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Comments:
<0> no ****
<1> jostein: I was building a news cluster a couple of months back and ended up writing my own nntp router to save some bandwidth (i/o and network).
<1> and then I ran away from that place :)
<0> getting DSL tomorrow.. the 25GBs I have left will be gone in -no- time
<0> exel: lol
<2> exel: You're still whoring yourself out to wannabe ISPs? :)
<2> Coma: Ey John, how's tricks?
<1> polarwolf: at current time, yeah. In the middle of building a start-up, though, life's a bit crazy atm.
<3> PolarWolf: Still overly busy, but I'm finally getting used to it ;)
<0> Coma: "Busy is another word for happy"</corporate_america> :P
<2> Coma: Hehe
<2> exel: Oh, cute. Anything good enough to share, or is it all hush hush NDA top secreet?
<3> Jostein: **** that. Neither busy nor happy have managed to get us out of the red figures :/
<3> Hopefully this year's first period will be a little more positive.
<1> polarwolf: well I'm not much for secrecy per se, but it involves taking over a bit of market by surprise by undercutting it with open source, so it's wisest not to get too specific :>
<0> Coma: our first period of the year is red as hell
<3> exel: you're going to market with a complete, drop-in replacement for windows, office, eggchange and sql server? =]
<0> Coma: overpriced locations downtown, payments for the first 3 months.
<1> coma: haha yeah I'll call it Pimux :)
<4> Jostein: We stay black, easy, in Q1
<2> exel: Ah
<5> heh
<0> Coma: clients taking it easy after xmas... we are red as hell :P
<4> Jostein: people buy new ERP software when the new budget scomes in ;)
<4> Jostein: It's Q3 that is likely to be red, although it was black last time
<0> wlfshmn: oh well. we're in a different kind of business though
<1> wlf: hence the saying "it must be budget season, it's raining ERP salesmen"
<3> Jostein: It's been mostly poor business for us, and a couple of major cockups that cost us a small fortune. Else the picture would've been a little prettier I guess
<2> exel: I dunno if that'll work. If economy is on the rise, proprietary software tends to be a default choice because it costs money thus is better
<4> exel:quite possibly ,)
<6> who has linux mandrake 10.1 on his pc
<6> ?
<4> exel: ofcourse, once they sign, it takes them another two years before they have figure out what their inteirely unique (in their mind, not ours) buisness requires
<1> polarwolf: this particular marketplace is full of residents that would really rather not pay.
<4> exel: this is what makes demoing our CRM software rather fun
<3> whyzzyrd: What came after whoring again? ;)
<2> personally, I find business software rather boring :)
<7> Coma: no, behind the Catholic Church.
<0> wlfshmn: CRM? ugh :P
<4> exel: they always -always- say something like "Yeah, we seem to require an extra table here to track <insertconcepthere>, and a few fields added to track the name of the favorite dog food of the user dog, in the contact table. how long would that takes to fix"
<1> wlf: but you're ruining it for everyone! where's the fun if you can't sell your software _with_ two years worth of integration consultancy?
<3> What, they beat the oldest fashion to it?
<4> exel: and I can go "hang on ... ... there. done".
<1> yeah that's what I feared, spoil-sport! :)
<2> wlfshmn: No, no!
<1> an army of SAP drones hate you intensely I gather ;)
<2> wlfshmn: You're *supposed* to say "that will take three months of design, six months of implementation and the migration path will take up two months. I cost $xxx/hr."
<4> exel: This is only for CRM ofcourse. The ERP software is a huge modular monolithic beast as the industry has come to expect
<1> wlf: ah ok then, you almost had me :)
<4> exel: not at all. this gives the impresison that everything else is equally agile, and they will sign before realizing that everything -else- has to be done by the regular group of sluggish consultants
<1> yeah I dig
<1> good strategy :)
<1> the 'ole bait&switch :)
<2> "hook, line and sinker" :)
<4> This is why I get stuck making the software dynamically build SQL for the configured tables and databases ;)
<8> it for everyone! where's the fun if you can't sell your software _with_ two years worth
<1> wlf: which has the added pleasure of needing to debug things on two different levels ;)
<2> $work is implementing Oracle eBS
<8> yarr.
<6> who has linux mandrake 10.1 on his pc ?
<4> PolarWolf: I'm debuggin such a thing right now as a matter of fact..
<2> wlfshmn: Any fun?
<1> things like "is my handler on crack or did I make a typo in my schema file?"
<4> exel: If you are nice, I might even show you the faulty little sql query that simply summarizes a table
<2> I hate programming. I want to sit back and look how well the systems I administer do their work
<0> exel: Ive stayed out of that field :P
<0> exel: closest thing Ive come to that is some cronjob generating a worker script that actually executes and does the job depending on what sort of stuff it finds
<1> jostein: I'm using it extensively for anything that needs to deal with xml and keep sanity intact.
<0> exel: as far as XML goes... I use parsers, and they usually does most of the dirty stuff for me
<4> Jostein: noone parses xml without using a dom or sax parser. not if they intend to remains sane
<1> jostein: I wrote the parser. Which gives me a major advantage in the way it deals with the actual parsing process, allowing me to treat data internally with c++ in about the same way as you expect from a php or perl array.
<4> exel: SELECT COUNT(vmop_contact.Field270), VMOV_BASE_CODEDESC.CODEDESC FROM vmop_contact,vmop_company, VMOV_BASE_CODEDESC WHERE (VMOV_BASE_CODEDESC.IDCOD = vmop_contact.Field270 AND VMOV_BASE_CODEDESC.IDLNG = 'en') AND vmop_company.idCUS = vmop_contact.GUIDROOT AND (vmop_company.idCUS IN (SELECT vmop_company.idCUS FROM vmop_company, VMOV_BASE_USER WHERE ((vmop_company.idUser = VMOV_BASE_USER.IDUSER AND vmop_company.idUser = 'ALCO') OR (vmop_compa
<4> exel: ;)
<3> Gees, good thing that got cut off.
<1> wlf: I like 'Field270' :)
<1> wlf: really re***uring :)
<4> exel: can't force customers to name fields sensibly. besides, only the database designer, adminsitrator and people like me see the fieldnames, users see the localizaed strings ;)
<1> wlf: It spells "maintainer's nightmare" in my head.
<1> but any complex project is a maintainer's nightmare, really :)
<4> exel: the naming is ***igned pased on the highest sortorder among existing fields in the table, and depending on how sparse they ***ign sortorders the number can get large. sane people rename the fields though (and all our baseline fields are sensibly named)
<0> exel: learn to use xpath or xquery instead :P
<4> exel: maintainers headache? no kidding, but the fieldnaming isn't the problem
<4> exel: it's the 50000loc of VB in there that creates headaches ;)
<2> wlfshmn: Gods, those queries bring back memories
<4> PolarWolf: nightmares, I expect
<4> whyzzyrd: nice
<0> wlfshmn: if you have to handle VB, I share your pain :P
<7> wlfshmn: I suspect it needs me to fix it.
<7> wlfshmn: but hell, can't go too wrong with it. Worst'll happen is I'll bin it.
<2> whyzzyrd: "given"?
<0> whyzzyrd: "been given"? wth?
<4> whyzzyrd: worst case, you end up frying your nads off by poking at the CRT wrong ;)
<1> jostein: it's more compact my way, usually looks like this:
<1> value indata;
<1> xmlschema inschema ("myschema.xml");
<1> indata.loadxml ("foo.xml", inschema);
<1> if (indata["system"]["datatype"] == "test") dotest (indata["testdata"]);
<8> :P
<1> could've sworn the hound was informed of my hostmask last time
<0> exel: seems OK, but I'd rather not have to write the parser :P
<9> I appologise, exel
<1> jostein: well I can get a bit grumpy when I need to do maintenance on the parser, but whenever I'm actually _using_ it, it completely rocks.
<0> exel: XmlDocument xd = new XmlDocument("filename"); if ("test" == xd.GetElementByName("foo")) {something} :P
<0> exel: thats not so hard either
<10> *cough*
<1> jostein: if you've got a lot of data to push, you've got a .cpp file full of "GetElementByFoo"s, it turns me nuts.
<0> exel: heh. I can always use XmlDataDocuemtn-cl*** and treat it like a DB table if the data can be reduced to that format :P
<2> Global flags for exel are now +fhD
<2> WTF are h and D?
<0> exel: anyway. No need for dynamic code-generation
<1> jostein: basically my parser is pretty smart at reducing various xml formats to such a format.
<1> it doesn't actually generate dynamic code
<1> but it does have aspects of metaprogramming in the schame-files that declare the way the parser should treat an xml format
<0> exel: oh well. you were the one saying you used it for XML :P
<0> exel: well. schemas are schemas
<1> jostein: I said 'dynanmic code and meta-programming', this is more in the realm of meta-programming.
<0> exel: What I love is XSLT :P
<1> xslt has its purposes
<0> exel: declarative programming is cool :P
<0> for a change anyway
<11> g'evening
<1> jostein: one more thing about your example, though. Mine was to access something like this: <myfancyxml><object id="system"><datatype>test</datatype></object><object id="testdata">...</object></myfancyxml>
<1> the path to 'test' being indata["system"]["datatype"] == "test" is nearly shorter than writing "GetElementByName"
<1> let alone if you need to go down four levels
<1> and it's not that it's _hard_ to do
<1> but it's hard to read back wtf you were doing
<1> and I hate that
<2> Java should be shortened. xd.GEBN("foo");
<0> exel: If most likely use xpath. xml.Query("/object[@system]/datatype");
<0> exel: pretty clean that as well
<4> would help if the query didn't take a minute to execute ;9
<12> **** no
<12> xml is NOT a substitute for a real database
<0> smsie: no. but its useful in places
<0> smsie: anyone replacing a DB for XML is insane
<1> smsie: only a total ****nut uses xml for data storage.
<12> Jostein: it's useful for confiuguration data...not for any kind of serious searchable data storage
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