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Comments:
<0> now I just need to get tomcat to agree with me
<1> PolarWolf: my old server - before it died a horrible death, used to lose 16 seconds a day...had to cron a netdate every twenty minutes...
<2> anyone here from Colorado?
<3> HmJ: Yeah, most boxes don't hold their time very well
<4> since I got kernel 2.6.x, I've been noticing drift, however that's been offset by the fact than I use ntpdate
<0> HmJ: NTPd? ;)
<5> tsokolat: '\o
<1> wlfshmn: nah, cron'd a script
<3> wlfshmn: These days I just schedule an rdate. Why bother with another daemon.
<6> anything over 5 seconds/day is a hardware problem and should be fixed, ***uming the rtc is actaully been used and the os isn't guessing....
<5> PeeCee's have always had crappy rtc clocks
<0> PolarWolf: my clients need time too anyway, so they might as well get it localy
<3> wlfshmn: Bleh, clients will get it from their kerberos tickets
<6> 5 or under is acceptable drift, given a ntp sync per hour is going to keep it to within a second - more than good enough for logfiles and stuff
<5> don't see why there are not usb dongles that get the shortwave atomic time
<6> XyZzY: there are
<6> XyZzY: but ntp is easier
<6> there are also pci boards for shortwave time
<2> XyZzY: i'm going to Colorado next week, thought I'd ask..
<4> I've heard of watches that sync to atomic time... dunno how, thoug.
<5> DaveHowe: I live like <50mi from boulder, CO a MAIN nist site
<4> ahhh.
<5> Viking667: have one. solar powered too
<4> We have time standards here in NZ too...
<5> Viking667: it's a radio set watch
<6> http://www.galsys.co.uk/atomic-clock/msf-rugby-atomic-clock.htm <-- here's one; rs232/usb (top item, TS-500-MSF)
<0> PolarWolf: yeah.. if there is an active directory around
<5> at midnight every day it listens to the radio and resets itself
<0> PolarWolf: none on my home-networkt though, obviously
<3> wlfshmn: You don't have one? :)
<5> tsokolat: cool. what for?
<6> note the 6000 module there too - standalone NTP timesource, stratum 1
<2> XyZzY: R&R.. :)
<5> tsokolat: dan_k is here too
<5> DaveHowe: gods that thing is m***ive
<0> DaveHowe: I don't quite have a need to be that exact and independent ;)
<6> XyZzY: the 6000 is a 1U module; the 500 is about four inches across
<6> XyZzY: there are other vendors too, but I know these are reliable as I have bought from them in the past
<5> DaveHowe: I was thinking of one the size of a thumbdrive
<7> why is it when I want a font I cant find it even thoe I know I have it...
<5> Becky: because X/progs are stupid about dealing with fonts
<8> Hey there everyone.. just wonbdering if anyone here knows anything about ataris? i thought it'd be best to ask here since i can't find any atari channels
<7> XyZzY i seem to even be inherating fonts I didnt even install....
<8> anyone in here any good with Atari's? particularly emagic - notator logic pweese? Looking for some info
<5> Flimflam: man are you lost
<5> DaveHowe: this is two years old even. Even then they are looking at teeny tiny devices for rtc http://www.embedded.com/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=46200241
<6> XyZzY: that's a hardware timesource; for radio reception, you need an arial (that said, a wifi receiver isn't much larger than a thumbdrive)
<5> DaveHowe: my watch don't
<6> XyZzY: if you know a way to pick up radio without an arial I am all ears
<8> anyone? :(
<9> DaveHowe: any idea what a 6000 costs from galsys?
<6> whyzzyrd: no. I just found tech; my boss did the budget and paperwork
<10> Dave: s/arial/aerial/
<6> whyzzyrd: must be scary though, given they wouldn't tell me via email how much stuff cost, but insisted that we had to "work with" one of their salesdrones to "acheive a solution"
<9> DaveHowe: ahh.
<5> DaveHowe: even the cheap usb devices are like $700
<9> DaveHowe: I'll contact em. It'd be cool to have a S1 server on campus, it'd still make our core routers 2, and our servers 3, but it's cool.
<9> DaveHowe: we use the janet stratum-1 service, so we are S2 at the core router level, which are our site time servers, and provide broadcasts on all subnets.
<6> whyzzyrd: sounds good. why change that (other than for geek coolness of course - having your own S1 is worth geek cool points :)
<11> whyzzyrd, get a T640
<11> :)
<9> DaveHowe: we make astronomical observations, and we could do with an independent source for if the net goes away.
<6> whyzzyrd: what is the drift on your strata-2 network if not locked to a beacon?
<6> whyzzyrd: I can't imagine it has to free-run for more than half an hour before you rig a dialup link to the net to give you a new time source and email traffic
<11> whyzzyrd, http://abilene.internet2.edu/images/T640-2.jpg
<6> fredk: isn't that a juniper ch***is?
<11> with 16 x OC192 , yeah ;)
<6> fredk: wasn't aware it could pick up atomic timesync broadcasts....
<11> DaveHowe, i'm sure it can do that too
<9> fredk_: How precisely does that be a stratum-1 timeserver?
<11> whyzzyrd, picky
<11> it's still a nice piece of hardware, just figured i'd mention it for the hell of it :)
<6> hmm. T640 msf doesnt' give me any google hits worth mentioning
<9> DaveHowe: The drift, across the synced 5 6513's is probably all and ****.
<6> whyzzyrd: I would probably just configure a fallback isdn route to an isp and forget it then - unless you want it for its geek appeal
<9> DaveHowe: We don't have one.
<12> 16xOC192 is a LOT of bandwidth
<0> anyone know a nice free texteditor for win32, that like ultraedit is capable of detecting changes to files on disk and reloading them (I'm mainly keeping logs open and don't want to manually reopen them)
<12> wlfshmn: textpad
<6> wlfshmn: vim
<10> textpad
<11> smsie, well technically it's 32 OC192
<9> DaveHowe: There's no easy way to get our ip's moved to a backup link..
<6> whyzzyrd: you don't have a routable block you can multihome then?
<0> smsie: fetching..
<9> DaveHowe: That said, we're getting a redundant fibre to Dundee, to the second RNAR router, which is connected to our dual 2.5G POS links, one to glasgow, one to leeds.
<6> whyzzyrd: besides, all you need is an isdn link to some host at a colo which is your fallback mailserver *and* can be a ntp proxy
<12> wlfshmn: just be a *little* careful...if it's a big file, textpad has been known to leak like a bitch
<9> DaveHowe: of course, but you try getting funding for such an eventuality.
<9> DaveHowe: our internet goes off once in a blue moon.
<11> fun stuff
<12> wlfshmn: it's quite nice though...has syntax highlighting etc...almost like a real editor, but for windows
<0> smsie: yeah, they will likely remains rather small (servlet-container logs primarily)
<12> wlfshmn: yeah, I use it to read 100M web services logs (they get a LOT of activity)...after an hour, you have to restart the damn thing or it will fall over. It's the only real problem with i though
<12> even has LaTeX highlighting
<0> smsie: seems nice, and satisfies my imidiate criteria ;)
<12> one of these days, I'm going to buy it
<0> smsie: although not free, atleast I don't have to do extra anughty stuff to keep it working without paying ;)
<12> it nags about once an hour as you save a file...that's not really a big inconvenience
<0> smsie: nope, especially not since I don't save the logs ;)
<12> :)
<12> wlfshmn: if all you're doing is looking at the, less works well :)
<12> I use less quite a lot to read logs
<12> gives me searching in both directions, and the ability to reload the file any time I want to
<6> wlfshmn: you can get funding for a stratum-1 but not for a fallback mailserver?
<6> smsie: and that isn't true for vim?
<4> smsie: I can search backwards in vim too...
<4> ?pattern
<0> DaveHowe: hum?
<6> <9> DaveHowe: of course, but you try getting funding for such an eventuality.
<4> but less doesn't edit the file, unless you call the external editor defined in $EDITOR or $VISUAL
<0> smsie: yeah, I want the editor to notify me if logs have changed though, since I typically don't know if they have or not
<0> smsie: if I were to use it, it would be some sort of watch tail combo
<11> hmm, they're showing resident evil 2 on tv
<0> fredk_: run the other way
<11> wlfshmn, come on, it's not THAT bad
<4> wlfshmn: I found out how to do that....
<11> well, it kinda is..but it's entertainment
<4> how to actually get watch and tail to work.
<12> wlfshmn: F in less
<12> wlfshmn: basically the same as tailing a file
<12> well, tail -f
<4> smsie: here's a easy one for you. combine watch and ps ax.
<11> wlfshmn, they're making a 3rd one too
<12> Viking667: no idea. I don't use watch very often
<4> lol. Well, it's trickier than it looks to combine tail with watch
<4> I found I had to stick the command into () and put the whole phrase into ''
<4> watch '(ps ax | tail)'
<12> Viking667: whatever you give to watch is p***ed to "sh -c", quoting correctly can be an absolute bitch
<4> yeah.
<4> I used '' just to see what it did... turned out it worked... thankfully.
<12> it's one reason I rarely use watch
<12> it's never really needed
<4> If I didn't use '' then I got: unexpected error near (ps
<12> while [ 1 ]; do clear; ps ax|tail -10; sleep 2; done
<4> smsie: well, I use it in that one example, and in a "watch uptime" scenario where I want to watch the load but not have top running.
<12> Viking667: the () aren't required. The '' are
<4> oh?
<4> all RIGHT!
<4> thank you, smsie
<9> DaveHowe: Yeah. I can get funding for an S1 server, because it'd be cool to have one, never mind if the internets go away or not.
<12> Viking667: in fact, I *think* the () spawns a subshell, which is just another thing to spawn that's not needed, so is Bad
<4> ... wonder if that's the same for [kza]sh/tcsh too?
<4> ahhh.
<9> DaveHowe: and we'd need a sizable backup line to get even the mail down.
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