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Comments:
<0> xdoclet for your struts stuff
<0> since struts requires lots of configuration in the many different xml files... you use xdoclet to easily configure them that way you don't have to constantly manually add stuff in the xml files. You can simply code your methods and add the xdoclet stuff in the commented header of the method
<0> and when you build the war with maven
<0> maven will generate the struts xml files based on your xdoclet info
<0> and then you also have the taglibs to learn if you don't already know about it
<0> and the templates
<0> lots of stuff
<0> you might as well use hibernate also
<1> needing a big tool to be able to handle an even bigger tool sounds wrong. i can see it working, and more importantly i can see it failing horribly.
<1> bbl
<0> and the thing I hate the most about struts is that you can't build cool things using AJAX way of thinking
<0> with struts every single thing a user does requires that a request be sent to the server
<0> the reeallly sad thing about this channel is that whenever I ask a question you people always ***ume that I'm a kid with a homework to do
<0> that's really sad
<2> Stop whining and do your homework !
<2> :D
<2> jk
<1> Bludlust: maybe the questions that you ask are the issue. google level questions typically look like homework questions.
<3> shark_, you could checkout jsf and spring, tho struts is more standard practise
<4> nite BryinAFK
<3> *practice
<3> springs a pretty good framework for most apps
<5> morning
<1> hi joe
<1> joeo: famous last words on struts?
<1> oh, and spring, while at it :)
<1> so far we have "<3> springs a pretty good framework for most apps"
<5> spring is great. Struts is now THREE frameworks, with one of them being viable.
<5> "spring is a pretty good framework" is damning with faint praise. I think Spring is fantastic, even though I disagree with why it was written. :)
<1> ok
<5> incidentally, the struts branch that's viable is being imported wholesale from webwork - it's not actually struts at all except in name.
<3> i never get too enthusiastic, so it's pretty high praise :p
<5> well, if there's any single framework that's out of spec to get excited about, it's spring.
<1> does that consider necessary vs. unnecessary complexity/obscurity? some people do not seem to care wether something is needlessly complex or not?
<5> you used to be able to say that about hibernate, but even it is in spec now
<5> Clackwell: what do you mean?
<5> Are you asking if I think Spring is needlessly complex?
<1> wether you have taken that into account when saying that "xyz is ok"
<5> yes, I have
<5> I don't think Spring is complex at all, actually
<5> the config is very capable, which means if you need certain things, you've potentially got some looking up to do
<5> but at its heart, it's very simple
<1> one could also take average joe java into account and how well one thinks he might fare with the framework in question. swing being an example of a framework a good number of people have issues with.
<1> joeo: ok, sounds good. i like simple.
<5> Clackwell: well, spring doesn't suffer from swing's need of gui knowledge
<5> swing is so simple that people invariably don't realise they DO need to actually know more than just popping stuff up on screen
<1> joeo: it should be harder to bring up something that looks ok at first glance, but really isn't? yeah, perhaps
<5> well, consider
<5> the designers of swing COULD have started event threads for you, so each event had its own thread, right?
<5> That would have solved a lot of performance issues... and introduced a ton of concurrency issues, which are usually even harder to solve than performance issues by an order of magnitude
<5> plus, unsuspecting people would have created situations where hundreds of threads were created due to event propagation
<1> joeo: i am not suggesting any particular solution or alternative approach to swing. i was more thinking along the lines of "do other solutions have the same, similar or alternative problems? (realbasic, vb, .net stuff, delphi)" and "is this framework too complex for average joe java programmer to use it right in the majority of cases? is it possible to learn how to use it properly for average joe or is it all around way too complex?"
<1> sorry for the delay, i am at work and got distracted. i try to keep irc on low priority at work. not that i manage well. :]
<6> morning all
<5> no worries :)
<1> hi kev: weren't you at freenode? did you get everyone to ignore you there? :)
<6> I was yesterday, though i don't remember everyone ignoring me :)
<5> KevSta: any time
<2> few ppl from outside the GMT+/- time zone
<6> Ah right ok, kind of makes sense now :)
<1> yeah, freenode is more active all around it seems to me.
<5> efnet's even more active if you can take it
<1> haha, yeah
<6> I don't usually go on there 'cept recently i've been going irc mad :o
<1> joeo: how many logins are in the channel at efnet?
<5> 134
<6> where are you guys from?
<5> USA
<3> i find this chan much more friendly
<5> trax`: and quiet
<3> less distraction :)
<6> what's the wheather like over there now? it's like freezing cold over here in england.
<7> hi, is there some library that can scan a string and if it finds charactest that have an xml entity that it can replace it with the entity?
<5> KevSta: we're in a warm spell
<5> but you have to remember that the US isn't really one nation - it's really 50
<5> CMB: ick. You could do it with a regex, though.
<5> find the entities, then replace them.
<1> trax`: if you are in for nicety, freenode might be a good place for you.
<7> is there a already done regex?
<5> I find freenode underinformed.
<5> CMB: not that I know of.
<3> just not being ignored is good enough :p
<6> haha
<5> heh
<5> well, efnet's definitely a meritocracy
<3> unfortunately
<5> why is that unfortunate?
<3> gets too elitist
<5> nah
<5> hacker meritocracy is different than social meritocracy
<5> if you're a hacker, you'll show up on radar no matter what your skill level
<3> i was speaking about efnet in general really
<7> joeo, I thought that the the java regex can giber tell you if a string is or not regex compliant not that it can change the string
<5> CMB: that's right
<5> java regex can pull out the matches for you, allowing you to reconstruct the string the way you want
<5> but if it's XML, why can't your XML lib do it for you?
<7> it's user input
<5> K
<7> I'd like to allow < > and other stupidities
<7> converting them to entities on the fly
<5> then... uh... okay, I'm missing something
<7> and I'd really like to delegate that to a external lib as there are a lot of entities
<5> you want to convert those TO entities?
<7> let me make and example
<7> if I'd get the string "Ol >" I'd need to convert it to "Olà >"
<6> I'll be back in a little while guys, just going to freshen up for my exam that i've got later on.
<5> ick. No, no mapping like that exists already that I know of, although google may.
<7> I myself think that would be overkill (not to mention that it'd worsten the searchability) but at least for the < > and some basic entities
<5> opensymphony has a cl*** for that, TextUtils
<5> see opensymphony.com
<7> thx
<5> it's in oscore
<7> let me see
<7> sweet
<1> shame there's no working jpan
<5> Clackwell: maven? :)
<7> jpan?
<1> there must be a million java text utility cl***es
<5> CMB: he's referring to a java equivalent to perl's CPAN
<1> and everyone keeps happily ignoring everyone else's, because they have no choice otherwise anyway.
<1> and given the **** up that some people code, i guess, also intentionally pretty often. ;)
<7> yes, maven helps you include it in your code base but it's not very granular
<5> and maven ****s :)
<7> infact I'll use maven2 right not to include opensymphone
<1> it should be an automatic system, centrally maintained. it should load the required jars in the proper versions at runtime, if not cached yet, and invoke the jvm with the proper parameters. the biggest chunk of work would be to collect links to the various jars, having fall back urls, dealing with unavailable jars, etc.
<5> and handling version conflicts
<5> which would, incidentally, be impossible
<1> joeo: can those arise?
<5> of course!
<1> joeo: i have the feeling that version conflicts are not in the scope of such a cpan/jpan system.
<5> Imagine someone using jarA 1.1 which relies on jarB 1.1's interfaces... and jarC 1.4 which relies on jarB's 2.0 interfaces
<5> that's depressingly common in Java
<1> joeo: hmhmhm
<1> hm. killer.
<1> it seems that this is in the scope of the developer.
<1> if he makes his app depend on jarX v2, which happens to use jarY v1, which is on conflict with something else he uses, that is a problem he needs to solve himself. and he would bump into the issue while developing, wouldn't he?
<1> on=in
<5> one hopes so.
<5> Of course, if he develops on JBoss and deploys on websphere....
<1> someone would, and he'd have to solve it.
<1> the system wouldn't deal with that. it just handles automatically fetching jars, non recursively.
<1> hm...or recursively? <shrug>
<1> one stumbling block would be network access, esp. in enterprise and rigidly controlled network environments.
<1> someone would have to tackle that sooner or later. preferably sun, in jse.
<1> better not :)
<5> let me know when it happens, eh
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