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Comments:
<Asriel`> How is #13 relevent in any way, shape or form?
<JBlitzen> #16, again all over that article
<JBlitzen> #13?
<JBlitzen> "
<Asriel`> the entire article is a set of facts from the adjutication, a set of quotes from the major and from other interested parties
<JBlitzen> you will often find that all the "news" stories about a given current event seem to draw a similar conclusion about it. When you notice this, just ask yourself if it's probable that, in a nation of nearly 300 million, no one has a legitimate opposing opinion.
<JBlitzen> "
<Asriel`> But the artcle draws no conclusions at all, it's not even an "article". It's a collection of facts!
<Asriel`> And it clearly lists the mayors offices opposing views, and links to other articles listing other people supporting him point of view
<JBlitzen> Their opposing views are meaningless
<JBlitzen> Understand what I'm saying?
<JBlitzen> I had to ask you what his side of it was
<Asriel`> no, because how can they be "meaningless"
<vawjrwrk> maybe JBlitzen can give us an example of a "real" news story
<JBlitzen> And you couldn't explain it with anything from that article, Asriel.
<Asriel`> And that's clear in the article
<JBlitzen> It's a biased story.
<vawjrwrk> since he's so ****ing sure this isn't one
<Asriel`> But Deputy Mayor Nicky Gavron said the incident had been "blown out of all proportion" and described the decision as absurd.
<JBlitzen> Now, maybe the guy's genuinely an ***hole
<JBlitzen> But I cannot conclude that from this article
<Asriel`> Mr Livingstone has said he was expressing his honestly-held political view of ***ociated Newspapers, but he had not meant to offend the Jewish community.
<JBlitzen> Since all it says is that he's an ***hole
<Asriel`> it doesn't *say* anything./ It's a factual report about a panel proceeding
<JBlitzen> Yeah, Asriel, that's not a reason for his view
<JBlitzen> Understand?
<Asriel`> It. Lists. What. Happens.
<JBlitzen> It only lists half the why
<JBlitzen> And the story is all about the why
<Asriel`> Then read the other article down the right, which lists they full history of the case
<JBlitzen> Either he's a racist, or he isn't
<JBlitzen> The story implies that clearly he is
<Asriel`> In what way?
<JBlitzen> He's being punished for being anti-semitic in some way
<vawjrwrk> you infer that he is
<Asriel`> Where does it say that he's a rasist?
<JBlitzen> Yes, based on what the story says, vic.
<JBlitzen> Understand?
<JBlitzen> That's how propaganda works.
<vawjrwrk> I read the story earlier
<Asriel`> See, it doesn't actually *say* that at all
<JBlitzen> They don't headline the article "mayor is racist, we hates him, oh we hates him!"
<JBlitzen> Of course it doesn't, Asriel.
<Asriel`> You've drawn that opinion from the list of *facts* presented, and that's your conclusion
<vawjrwrk> I didn't get that from the story
<JBlitzen> That's how propaganda works.
<JBlitzen> It convinces you to accept a position as valid without ever considering that it may be invalid.
<vawjrwrk> we know how propaganda works
<JBlitzen> That's how propaganda works.
<JBlitzen> No, you really don't.
<Asriel`> How is it propoganda?
<JBlitzen> You think propaganda works like you work.
<Asriel`> It's not ****ing propoganda, it's a factual list of stuff
<vawjrwrk> I can't take it any more
<JBlitzen> It's not factual
<JBlitzen> You said yourself it's a series of quotes
<Asriel`> It lists what happened. It lists what people said about what happened
<JBlitzen> That's not factual
<Asriel`> Sure it is. People said those things
<vawjrwrk> huh?
<JBlitzen> Doesn't matter.
<Asriel`> It's a report of what happened today at the proceeding
<Asriel`> So what should it say?
<JBlitzen> By giving them a voice, it presents their claims
<JBlitzen> Without factually investigating them
<JBlitzen> And some of these claims are downright meaningless.
<Asriel`> Indeed. and it lists both sides
<vawjrwrk> geezus christ, JBlitzen give it a ****ing rst
<vawjrwrk> no story can quote someone on the scene???
<Asriel`> Leaving people to actually interpret it, and follow the links on the right for more information
<Asriel`> It's a *report*, not an *investigation*
<vawjrwrk> or it becomes biased???
<JBlitzen> "He spoke out against Jews" "He ignored the significance of the Holocaust" "He's a great guy, really!"
<JBlitzen> You tell me how that's fair
<Asriel`> How is that unfair?
<JBlitzen> Uh, it's obviously unfair
<Asriel`> The people who brought the case said that. He was found guility of the case
<JBlitzen> If those were the exact quotes in an article, they're clearly biased
<Asriel`> It lists their comments
<Asriel`> It lists his comments
<JBlitzen> You really are stupid about this, aren't you
<Asriel`> How could you possibly unbias it anymore?
<JBlitzen> Stop thinking that way
<Asriel`> You want them to add extra quotes that don't exist supporting him side?
<vawjrwrk> Asriel` don't report it?
<JBlitzen> My question is, how could you bias it any more?
<vawjrwrk> no
<JBlitzen> How WOULD you write it so that it was propaganda?
<vawjrwrk> you're the one ***erting it's biased....... HOW WOULD YOU MAKE IT NOT???
<Asriel`> By saying "These facts clearly show that Ken Livingson is a rasist"
<JBlitzen> You can't say that
<Asriel`> Now, how can you *unbias* it?
<Asriel`> What more could they have done?
<JBlitzen> How WOULD you write it so that it was propaganda?
<Asriel`> They went. They said what happened.
<vawjrwrk> because these facts DON'T show he's a racist?
<JBlitzen> You can't just say that he's racist.
<JBlitzen> Because that's argumentative.
<Asriel`> Then people draw their conclusions
<JBlitzen> You said it yourself, the BBC is legally prohibited from being argumentative.
<Asriel`> Yes, but you're not answering the question. How could that be more *unbias* without motting information
<JBlitzen> So I ask you, what would you do differently, legally, to be propaganda?
<Asriel`> No, they're legally obligated to be politically unbais
<JBlitzen> Yes, so they can't say he's a racist.
<vawjrwrk> JBlitzen nope, you're chanign the subject
<Asriel`> Answer my question first, then I'll answer yours
<JBlitzen> Now answer my question, vic.
<vawjrwrk> YOUR the one that claims it's propaganda
<JBlitzen> I addressed everything you asked me until this one.
<vawjrwrk> NO
<Asriel`> How could that article be *less* "bias" in your eyes
<vawjrwrk> bull****
<JBlitzen> I already explained it repeatedly, Asriel, now it's your turn.
<vawjrwrk> you claim that quoting people is bias
<vawjrwrk> bull****
<JBlitzen> Don't evade just because you can't answer without proving yourself wrong.
<Asriel`> You've not said anything at all
<vawjrwrk> you're tossed out platitudes
<JBlitzen> Answer the question.
<JBlitzen> Stop evading, vic and asriel.
<Asriel`> You've jumped in with the initial ***umption that it's "propoganda"
<JBlitzen> Answer the question.
<vawjrwrk> YOU ANSWER THE FUKCING QUESITON
<Asriel`> When there's *no* evidence of that
<JBlitzen> Stop evading.
<JBlitzen> Answer the question.
<Asriel`> Oh, I give up
<Asriel`> There's no question to answer
<JBlitzen> So, you admit I'm right?
<JBlitzen> Fine then.
<Asriel`> Because it's not ****ing propoganda
<JBlitzen> [17:06] <JBlitzen> How WOULD you write it so that it was propaganda?\
<vawjrwrk>
<ugnud> does c++ count 0 as NULL?
<Asriel`> Ah, glad you did that.
<vawjrwrk> GODDAMNED ****IJNG IDIOT
<Asriel`> ugnud - no, not technically
<Asriel`> but "yes", for certain interpretations
<JBlitzen> Okay, clearly you want to lie about me.
<Asriel`> technically, NULL if a (void *)0
<JBlitzen> That ****'s over, vawjr.
<vawjrwrk> do you really want me to reduce your access to 1
<ugnud> well the value of my 2d array at 0,0 is usually 0 and when i do a if(blah[0][0] == NULL) and blah[0][0] is 0 then it executes that statement
<JBlitzen> Don't you ever ****ing lie about me again, vawjr.
<JBlitzen> You will grow the **** up.
<vawjrwrk> what lie, dipstick??|
<vawjrwrk> maybe some year you will
<Asriel`> He didn't say anything. You introduced a straw man ***umption that the article is propoganda with no evidence whatsoever
<JBlitzen> [17:07] <vawjrwrk> JBlitzen nope, you're chanign the subject
<vawjrwrk> you come in here, tell everyone they don't know anything, throw up strawmen and demand ****ing answers
<Asriel`> Then asked us to answer a question that made no sense
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