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Comments:
<0> hey anyone around?
<0> vawjrAFK, you there?
<0> guess not
<1> If I were to write a console IRC program I would need to make one thread to print what people are saying on the screen and one thread so the user could send data, right?
<2> All right, kiddies. My times's up.
<2> see you all later ;-)
<3> again, on vc++ nobody answers, so here I go: I've just created a tab control containing 2 tabs
<3> how do I add controls to those tabs?
<3> do I have to design new dialogs and add them inside the tab control? It's really confusing I've read a lot on this subject and I haven't found any clean win32 example on this subject, only mfc
<4> what's so good about c?
<5> Not much, if you ask a C++ fan.
<5> If you ask a C nut, he'll tell you it could possibly cure cancer.
<4> lol
<1> well it is easier to code an OS in C
<1> XD
<1> ;)
<5> Than what, VB?
<5> Probably so.
<1> well i mean you do have to account for those extra libs with c++
<1> that's all i'm saying
<1> :)
<5> No you don't.
<1> i have no preference one way or the other.
<5> I know you're being flip, and I'm not slamming you, but this is a common misconception about C++.
<1> yeah you do
<5> That it's bigger, that it's slower, that it carries more baggage.
<5> No, it doesn't.
<1> no no
<1> i'm talking about osdev
<1> :)
<1> i'm not saying it's slower
<5> I'm talking about anything you can write with either language.
<1> ok
<5> I can write equivalent code in C++ and C and end up with pretty much the same executables.
<1> of course
<5> Except the C++ code will be less verbose and as safe or safer than the C code.
<5> That's all.
<5> I figure you know all this already, but sometimes I have to restate this stuff for the n00b lurkers.
<1> I'm just saying it's annoying, if you use c++, sometimes to make sure you have the extra stuff compiled into your kernel
<5> I'm not sure what extra stuff you mean.
<1> and it's just as annoying to have to rewrite most of the functions for C
<1> Solamente, if I use the standard library, it has to go in there somewhere :)
<5> The C++ standard library is the ultimate in pick-and-chooose development.
<5> What you don't use isn't compiled in.
<5> That's the entire mantra of C++ language design: "You don't pay for what you don't use."
<1> yeah
<1> it has nothing to do with that lol
<1> and everythign to do with you have to make sure you put in what is necessary or it dies XD
<1> :)
<1> Did I tell you about the programming cl*** I am taking this semester?
<5> No.
<1> two cl***es of two hours a piece and we are still on the basic structure of main
<1> and just started what #include is
<6> I've yet to see C/C++ taught well at university level
<1> for sure
<1> it's a "programming cl***" that uses c++ as a vehicle
<1> :/
<6> I come more and more to the opinion that people shouldn't teach languages at all, really
<1> agh
<5> That's a flaw, right there. You can learn programming while learning a language, or you can learn programming concepts, but I've yet to see the two taught well together.
<5> I think I'd rather see programming taught with a bonehead-simple language like JavaScript.
<1> :(
<1> oh man
<5> Learning programming *can* be done with C++, but so few people teach it properly.
<6> I'd probably start with a purely functional language. The functional programming course I'm taking at the moment is taught in Haskell, and that's pretty good
<5> They get hung up on the esoterica.
<5> Asriel: That would be beneficial, too. In fact, JavaScript is much more interesting when used as a functional language.
<5> I think an intro to programming should cover a number of paradigms.
<6> Indeed. The big problem I think people have is that a lot of cl***es people want to take are "applied" CS
<3> can somebody help me with my problem?
<1> i'm about to drop my CS/CSIS major
<1> and go to physics
<3> I need just a hint
<5> Most of the people I work with come from an ***embly or C background, and they're totally lost with functional languages like XSLT, or they treat JavaScript as a crippled C, because they only know one paradigm.
<1> at least i'll learn somethin
<6> so to get people to that level, they need to cram a language with all the accoutrements they need down their throat
<6> SB - Wise, if you can already program
<6> I'm taking a math major - CS minor purely for the mathematical CS courses
<5> sk8ing: IIRC, it's a matter of creating one borderless child window per tab, and showing and hiding them as necessary.
<1> i can program "adequitly"
<5> There's got to be something on codeproject or MSDN.
<6> like functional programming, complexity, semantics etc that our math department don't offer
<3> Solamente, thank you
<6> depends what you want to do after graduation really - or why you're at college in the first place
<1> i mean yeah
<7> I'd rather call XSLT a dysfunctional language.
<6> because people use it badly
<5> Pfft. XSLT owns.
<6> it's not a general purpose language, it's a data transformation language
<6> people try to write huge chunks of logic in it, which it's rarely suited to
<5> As long as you treat it like it was designed. Too many people try to make it procedural, and it will bite you for that.'
<6> of course, these are the same people who write entire programs using TSQL
<5> Once you get it, it's a little like C++ templates. You become amazed by what it can really accomplish.
<5> Actually, it's a lot like C++ templates. The real work happens in the processing, and the results just sort of fall out.
<6> a solid handle on recursion is something that people really need to grasp before they take on XSLT
<5> Indeed.
<6> and not the "It's a function that calls itself" definition that most people get stuck on
<6> another reason for learning a functional programming language
<6> doh, out of coffee.
<0> recursion as a concept is taught in like every CS 101 cl***... it helps to have some CS background if you want to program, basically
<8> Asriel u're right
<6> WhatAHam - But recursive design is rarely taught properly
<0> you are probably right.. what do you mean by recursive design?
<8> Asriel do u usually use C++ 4 programing ?
<6> starting with a large problem, and operating on it by looking at a small part of it, and reusing the algorithm for that small part on the rest of the data
<6> people get stuck in a linear, procedural mindset too easily
<6> I use whatever the heck seems most appropriate for the problem I'm solving
<8> aha :)
<0> yeah heh
<6> this weekend, I've used shell scripting, C++, haskell, javascript and PHP
<1> really
<1> i've used... c#
<1> lol
<8> _m_ lol
<6> indeed. the website for the last contract I finished is written in PHP, as it was maliable enough for me to construct a database modeling system and semantics to support it easily
<1> i like php
<8> Asriel well i made my personal web
<1> does a reasonible job for what it's supposed to do
<6> the monitoring tools for it are written in Javascript, for the OS X Dashboard. C++, I used to help solve a small question. Bash scripts build my LaTeX files
<8> i used yahoo prog websdisignin
<6> and Haskell, I needed to finish some exercises for a course I'm taking
<6> Everything in it's place, for a purpose.
<8> Asriel gimme ur openion abt my site :) if u have time bro
<6> and I guess TeX is a language as well, so there's another one
<6> The common analogy is that languages are the tools of a programmer. You wouldn't be surprised if you hired a joiner and he used a dozen tools to build something
<8> Asriel !!
<6> erm, I'd rather not render an opinion on that other than to say, don't use popup windows
<6> also,, don't message people
<0> i wish employers hired good programmers rather than experts on one partivular tech
<8> am sorry 4 bothering u Asriel
<1> i wish employers hired me to sit on my ***
<1> i'm not in that position yet :(
<0> i am.. heh.. i sit on my *** all day and do like 10 hours of real work a week hahaha
<1> nice
<1> :)
<1> haha
<1> Asriel, I think i am too stupid to do physics though
<6> I've not taken Physics since high school
<6> I'm of the school that anyone who actually applies themself can generally do whatever they want
<6> it'll take some people more time/effort than others, but it's generally possible
<9> hrm...
<9> You're younger than 25, Asriel?
<6> And hey, undergrad degrees are getting easier all the time, it's worth a shot - you can always switch majors again :)
<1> Asriel, for sure.
<10> #Dreadfull
<3> shouldn't GetClientRect() return the relative position of the client space from the windowrect? that means that rect.top of the client should be TitleBarSize?
<11> Hm isn't the title bar in the client rect?
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