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Comments:
<0> if we're wrong, oh well - we got new energy sources
<0> the worst case scenario for emissions targets is that is kicks the *** of the energy industry to do more than just drill
<1> What
<0> the best case is that it saves the world
<1> If you don't know what's going on, and you don't know how you're affecting it, changing your actions is as risky as holding to them.
<1> For all you know, carbon dioxide emissions are the only thing standing between us and a new ice age.
<0> let it revert back towards the natural state would seem to be the most sensible option
<1> Isn't that just logical?
<0> Hell, even just carrying on at recent emissions levels would be sensible
<1> The natural state is constant change.
<1> The earth changes.
<0> currently, the emission curve is exponentially rising
<1> It's been doing that for all of time.
<1> We didn't cause the changes.
<0> yes, but not by the hands of it's inhabitents
<1> We didn't kill the dinosaurs or cause or end the ice ages or create the continents or mountains or oceans
<2> lol I like this: <0> let it revert back towards the natural state would seem to be the most sensible option
<1> It's not changing by the hands of its inhabitants now, either.
<0> So you claim. Other people, many others, think differently
<1> I don't care.
<1> What makes you so highly respect their random thoughts?
<0> And even if theres a small chance they're right, it would seem to be a good idea to fix it
<3> Every time JBlitzen farts, thousands of baby penguins die
<1> Asriel, that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
<0> The fact that there are thousands of reputable scientists saying it
<1> No there aren't.
<0> Er, yes there are
<3> Thousands of dead baby penguins
<0> Head in the sand doesn't work here. I don't doubt there are thousands saying it's not happening
<1> There are hardly any reputable climate change scientists saying that we're responsible for climate change.
<1> And no science that says it.
<1> I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks otherwise is insane.
<0> JB, that's just not true
<1> It's perfectly true.
<1> What was the recent report by the NAS about climate change? It might be happening, and we might be causing it.
<1> Well, great.
<1> It might not be happening, or we might not be causing it.
<3> I'm sure the guy who came up with the stereotypical USian met JBlitzen
<0> no science report is ever going to come out and say "100% SURE WE'RE DOING THIS"
<1> Those claims are utterly irrefutable.
<0> that's not science, that newspaper headlines
<1> What depleting ozone, floyd?
<0> CFCs did
<1> Do you actually buy into this crap?
<2> that's the only way to change your mind is to give you actual data proof JB
<0> That was actual demonstrable. You could get a jar of CFC, mix ozone in and watch i
<1> That's true, floyd.
<1> Show me data.
<1> Show me proof.
<1> Don't show me "he said she said".
<2> is that the only way you'll say, oh ok, you don't have 2 proove it
<1> Don't tell me "well it might be so we should pretend it is"
<0> JB - When theo nly proof you'll accept is the hand of god coming down with a stone tablet saying "ITS TRUE", that can't be done
<0> experimental science is a game of percentages
<1> Floyd, you shouldn't accept anything BUT proof and data.
<0> EVERY SINGLE reputable source will always have some elemenvt of doubt
<3> [quotemsg=220782,1056,6716] St andr mme en quatrieme secondaire tout le monde en costar, c'est vachement cl***e je trouve :sol:[/quotemsg]
<0> anything that has a 0 error margin is not science, it's crap
<3> Oops
<1> Asriel, I'm sorry, but socialism isn't science.
<2> well, the fact is, there are people out there who specialize these kinds of things, and believe it or not they aren't a happy bunch
<3> http://www.theozonehole.com/ozonehole2005.htm
<1> Science isn't a vote, or the largest union wins.
<3> The 2005 edition
<0> JB - Huh? I'm not talking about any political opinion
<1> Science deals with facts.
<1> Not opinion.
<0> experimental science deals with evidence
<1> You haven't uttered a fact in ten minutes.
<1> Nor evidence.
<0> then you draw conclusions from the evidence
<1> All you've said is "some people think this, so we should act as though this is true"
<1> That's not science.
<1> That's absurd.
<0> Some people have looked at the evidence, and come to the conclusion that it's happening
<0> What more can I say? I'm not a climate scientist
<1> It's actually frightening, is what it is.
<0> Other people have looked at it, and said it's not happening
<0> I can't comment on that. I can common on, if it *is* happening, we don't want it to happen
<4> what happened of the cars working with water?
<1> Even other peopl have looked at it, and said the reverse is true, that the globe is cooling.
<1> Or will cool.
<3> tataQaq: it sank
<1> You have every possibility being uttered with some scientific support.
<1> That's not unusual.
<3> I have looked at it
<4> either water or hydrogen water
<3> More baby penguins will die
<4> or maybe bio diesel
<1> [17:38] <2> well, the fact is, there are people out there who specialize these kinds of things, and believe it or not they aren't a happy bunch
<4> but thats a rarity neway
<0> I don't think anyone would argue that the default best position is "not much change from now"
<1> Floyd, you're only thinking of the people who sound like they specialize in it, who support you.
<0> JB - As are you
<1> Excuse me, that's a lie.
<0> and if we can bring about a "No change for now", that would seem to be a good thing
<1> Don't lie about me.
<1> I've told you that before.
<0> JB - What do you believe is happening?
<1> [17:40] <1> Floyd, you're only thinking of the people who sound like they specialize in it, who support you.
<1> [17:40] <0> JB - As are you
<1> [17:39] <0> Some people have looked at the evidence, and come to the conclusion that it's happening
<1> [17:39] <0> Other people have looked at it, and said it's not happening
<1> [17:39] <1> Even other peopl have looked at it, and said the reverse is true, that the globe is cooling.
<1> [17:39] <1> Or will cool.
<1> [17:39] <1> You have every possibility being uttered with some scientific support.
<1> [17:39] <1> That's not unusual.
<0> JB - Yes, because you sit there and say everyone saying it's not happening is wrong
<1> My entire point is that there's no scientific consensus.
<0> THERE NEVER IS
<0> There's no scientific concensus about gravity
<1> Really?
<0> I wouldn't like to jump off a building
<1> Earth round, gravity real
<2> what are you afraid is going to happen if you say ok, I'll just think about this for a minute, well, lets see 6,000,000,000 people living on the earth, with a small amount of them thinking about what the **** they're doing to the envirnment
<1> Jumping off a cliff on to soil = bad
<0> Well, climate getting hotter over the last 50 years is also irrefutable
<0> Therefore climate change real?
<1> It's NOT irrefutable.
<1> And even if it was, that's not human change.
<0> Look at the graph
<1> What graph?
<1> Science is a graph?
<0> Are you sure?
<1> I'm positive.
<0> http://www.grida.no/climate/vital/17.htm
<3> The climate is getting warmer cause I'm so hot
<1> Oh, the magical graph of science.
<1> I can't wait to see this link.
<0> It's the first graph google gave me
<1> Trend in global average surface temperature.
<1> Great.
<0> It's as real as the evidence that I will fall down if I jump off a building
<0> What's causing it is the only question here
<0> And there's never any concencus in science about the "what", ever
<1> So a thermometer on a building that used to be in the middle of a shaded forest is now recording warmer temperatures since it's surrounded by forty miles of asphalt, concrete, and steel.
<1> That's an amazing graph, Asriel, and thank you so much for providing it.
<1> Unfortunately, it doesn't mean anything whatsoever.
<5> Asriel no, it's refutable, read the article
<0> Oh, I give up. I don't know why I ever "discuss" with you
<0> If Bush came out and said "SKY IS GREEN", you'd be claiming any evidence to the contrary was a liberal lie
<2> no JB the world is full of asphalt
<5> Asriel this h as nothing to do with Bush
<3> I'm so hot asphalt melts
<1> Heh ashe
<0> My only point is, if it is changing, and there is a chance we can effect it, we should
<1> Actually that's not real funny now
<0> even if it's only a 5% chance, it would seem to be a good gamble
<1> It's summer here :~(
<1> ~~~~:(
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