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Comments:
<0> just hand the object's mesh to your 3d engine... if you're writing a 3d engine, then stop
<1> rdragon, why stop? :D
<2> rdragon: following the same logic. never implement anything. it's all been done before.
<0> not because it's been done
<0> because you don't have the resources to scratch the surface
<1> but i want to, and i'm actually slowly progressing
<1> fact being when i started i didn't know what an integer is
<0> you could be a lot more productive and learn more by tackling a reasonable project
<2> 3d engines aren't all that hard. u can make a very good one if u live with your parents
<1> i am working on a project, but it needs it's own engine, it's not exactly a full 3d game
<0> why does it need it's own engine?
<1> dextre1, i have that advantage :D
<0> why not use one of the hobbyist engines like ogre / irrlicht ?
<2> but if u got a short timeframe.. then u should definitely use something free
<1> because i want to later write a full tutorial on how i did it
<2> rdragon: they aren't all that great
<0> no, they're not
<0> but they're a lot better than anything you could write given 10 years
<2> but sometimes we can settle with software like windows.. cuz we're lazy
<0> and you can't afford any of the real engines, so...
<2> 10 years is wayyy too much time
<0> that's my point
<2> 3d engines are a dime a dozen these days
<2> it's not that hard
<0> not good ones
<2> and it's kinda pointless to talk about the difficulty in doing it.. it's more about the feature set
<1> well i'm not writing a doom3 equivalent engine am i?
<2> a lot of them have wayyy too many features.. for what someone might need for a simple game
<0> ogre has a much bigger feature set than you'll have in 10 years
<2> it's like the GSL, why use the GSL for a game? don't
<0> too many features?
<0> don't use them all, then
<1> rdragon, what's so negative about learning? i want to know how it ticks, simple as that
<0> because you're not learning
<0> you're crawling
<1> elaborate
<0> you and a billion other kids writing 3d engines
<0> and operating systems
<0> and mmorpg's
<1> hey some actually succeed, isn't that the point? :D
<0> none have succeeded
<1> if none would have succeeded we wouldn't have games atm
<0> sure we would
<0> for the reason we do
<0> not because some kid in his parents basement coded something spectacular
<2> rdragon: everyone is a noob at some point
<0> but because people with money hired talented people to put it together
<2> and the world needs pessimists to give other ppl a reason to challenge them
<0> yep, that's why they shouldn't be writing 3d engines
<2> you gotta start somewhere right, why not start with something easy.. like 3d engines
<3> step 1 : learn to program
<0> step 2: ?
<0> step 3: 3d engine
<1> rdragon, point being if i stop now, i'll not have a reason to learn
<3> goto step 1
<2> step 2: hello world
<2> step 4: goto step 1
<0> |Serpent if you stop now, you actually have a chance of creating a project that is completable
<0> and then you have something nice to show for your time and effort
<0> and you would have learned a lot more, more efficiently
<1> rdragon, hmm, mmm, has anyone actually taken that advice, ever? :D
<2> rdragon: the hobbyist gives up eventually . u know that. u can't collect stamps forever
<0> but *shrug* I don't really care if you succeed or not - if you don't, that's just less job competition for me ;)
<1> hehe
<2> but it beats giving up and not having tried at all simply because rdragon told you so
<1> yeah
<0> sure, if you want to live in your parent's house forever
<0> then you can tell everyone you defied rdragon
<0> and they will laugh, twice
<2> so give it a shot, come back 10 years later, maybe you'll be giving out the same advice just like rdragon
<0> just head to gamedev.net and you can see thousands of never-will-be's implementing 3d engines and mmorpg's
<1> rdragon, i'm not doing it to defy anyone, tbh
<1> rdragon, i'm there daily dude :D
<0> and you can see lots of them wanting to join forces to create their own little cespool of non-talent and non-productivity
<1> what about the sheer willpower?
<0> what about thinking realistically?
<1> i could spend all day playing my mmorpg or bf2, or on porn, instead i drown myself in books and try and create something of my own
<2> i agree with rdragon, but only because i've been there, not because i believe everything he says
<4> mmm, drowing one self in porn... healthy
<4> lol
<0> lol
<1> haha
<2> so go ahead and give it a shot serpent, u'll figure out if it's worth it real soon
<0> |Serpent - I'm just saying, if you attempt something reasonable, you'll be much better off
<3> not to cast any "asparagus" rdragon is probably speaking from experience...just like the rest of us
<1> it has already been worth it, the little i know already is worth the time spent
<0> but what has it gotten you?
<1> bealtine i know that, hell, i know rdragon is right, but i just have time
<2> regret regret and regret
<1> rdragon, knowledge
<2> nothing is more fulfilling than pr0n
<0> but nothing unique that you can leverage
<0> do you do anything for a living?
<0> (how old are you?)
<1> rdragon, i'm not doing it for money if that's what you're asking, in fact if i'll ever succeed i won't sell the game i'm building, it'll be free
<1> uh huh 21
<0> you don't have to 'do it for the money'
<1> it was a response to "what have you gained"
<0> but it would be nice to make a career out of something, so that you have money
<0> ah, maybe you're still in school then
<1> ofc, if i'll understand how it all ticks then yeah i'll most likely will try and get a job in the business
<1> nope, no school
<2> rdragon: what about your game? you're not gaining anything beyond hubris and the idea that shadowbane might live on in someone elses opensource projects, right?
<0> in the business = in the game development business?
<1> yeah
<0> dextre1 the shadowbane thing was just a little project I did this weekend
<2> do u do other little things every weekend? or is it just work work work
<0> |Serpent if you don't have a degree, you're going to have to be a really solid programmer to get a job as a game developer
<2> we do little things every now and then between cl***es too
<0> well, even if you have a degree that's still true
<0> dextre1 well I'm sorta between jobs, waiting to move out of here, so I needed something to do
<1> rdragon, what if i'll actually succeed in what i'm doing, thinking now won't it add a little something to my chances?
<2> ah. that's coo
<0> |Serpent nobody wants you to write a 3d engine
<1> rdragon, i know, i mean it as a testament of my ability
<0> they want to see that you are a serious programmer and worker
<2> serpent: is there a fun factor to this? just say yes and rdragon can't touch you!
<0> the fact that you have no degree will raise questions, too
<1> dextre1: ofcourse, duh :D
<0> well
<1> rdragon: no money for university, simple as that
<0> unless you can bang out a really nicely engineered engine, it's not going to mean much
<2> are u going to argue that it's in fact not fun for serpent?
<0> but when I went through a bunch of interviews, none of them cared to see a demo, or code
<1> it's more gratifying than any game i've played so far, so yes, it's fun :D
<0> so while it might be nice to show a demo, it's not something people really look for
<0> it would be more worthwhile to be able to -use- an existing engine - that means you have the ability to leverage something that someone else has done
<0> and be able to show a broad sense of knowledge
<2> oh ****. i have a meeting to attend
<1> rdragon, well if i'll give up on that then maybe i'll go get a free existing engine but first i need to give it a shot
<2> there's a thunderstorm outside and i have to walk
<1> yea brb too, gotta walk the dog
<1> dextre1, ouch
<0> i had a bunch of questions just generally scoped at how I work - how I debug, how I write documentation, how much experience I've had working with a team, etc
<2> yeah, some bastard stole my bike
<0> and then lots of nitpicky C++ related stuff
<0> and then code challenges - 'write a function that does X extremely efficiently'
<0> or 'implement fixed-point stuff'
<0> shrug
<0> if you concentrate on a 3d engine, that's extremely limited in scope
<0> and unless all want to be is a graphics programmer, you probably should be doing something else
<0> and know that most people don't start out by getting jobs on the engine team - so you'll easily be able to pick up 'how to write an engine' after you've worked under and seen how the pros do it
<0> my back hurts like hell... pinched a nerve
<2> **** i don't want to go out there..
<2> it's raining so hard
<1> back, yea rdragon i know, also i got some of my own ideas i want to make into games, and uh it's just too gratifying to give up
<1> dextre1, call in sick? :D
<4> yay
<4> people are showing up for work
<4> and i've yet to sleep
<2> lol
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