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Comments:
<0> Don't worry, you'll find someone who likes you one day
<0> (and after one day he won't like you anymore)
<1> Haha, I just can't with you.
<2> I like Ashe. He makes me look better by comparison.
<1> Hahaha
<1> Seen on a button at an SF Convention:
<1> Veteran of the Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force. 1990-1951.
<0> Heheh
<3> hi
<1> Hello Int3
<1> This sentence does in fact not have the property it claims not to have.
<0> You sound extremely bored
<3> hi _exe
<1> Haha, yeah.
<1> "I'll be Bach." -- Johann Sebastian Schwarzenegger
<0> O_o'
<1> If "con" is the opposite of "pro", then what is the opposite of progress?
<3> congress
<4> Nice one, exe.
<0> You're so smart Int3
<0> I couldn't find the answer
<1> (Halley's comment.)
<1> UGH
<1> /* Halley */
<1> The last good thing written in C was Franz Schubert's Symphony #9.
<5> has anyone here done 3d texture mapping in software ?
<6> of course
<6> but there are plenty of texts about it on the net
<0> Usually with a copyright from 1992
<5> indeed
<0> But TCA can probably help you
<0> He made some software graphics lib
<6> 92 ?
<5> the only question i have for right now is: you've got vertices that have z coordinates, and thats all well and good, but how should you get z coordinates for all of the pixels within the polygon
<5> for the z-buffer
<0> Scan lines?
<5> seems to me like lots of interpolating
<6> i think it is
<5> apparently you'd have to line draw between each vertex, getting z coords for each pixel on the edge, and then interpolate each of those scanlines for every pixel
<5> i was hoping there would be a simpler way to go about it
<0> If you can draw to the framebuffer, I'm not sure why it's difficult to write to the z-buffer
<0> You just put the depth instead of the color
<5> yes but you have to find the exact z of each pixel within each polygon
<6> and ?
<0> Sounds right
<5> this is all stuff i just ***umed, so i'm not sure if its really done that way; thats why i asked
<6> just do it work then optimise :)
<0> It's easy to optimize, just throw away the rendering part of the code and use OpenGL or D3D instead
<6> lol
<5> yeah, but thats not challenging
<0> Rendering that much low level represents like 2% of your app once you add all the other stuff
<0> So there are many other challenging things
<6> it is challenging just for initializing d3d !
<5> you're right, but i'm just determined to make a software renderer
<0> Yes, it's at least 3 lines
<5> its pretty good so far
<5> although i do have to use sdl to write to the framebuffer portably
<5> but i also wrote a bmp outputter that eliminates that :)
<5> i've got wireframe with wasd movement and mouselook so far
<6> http://www.flipcode.com/articles/index.shtml
<5> have flat shading functions written, but the z-buffering needs to be implemented. after that, i'll have hard drivin'
<0> movement and mouselook shouldn't be part of a software renderer
<0> :p
<0> Unless you mean just having transformations
<5> well it transforms from object to world to camera to screen
<5> and the fps input moves the camera
<0> You have a camera space?
<5> yes
<0> Usually it's world model view
<0> And modelview together, most of the time
<5> thats opengl speak :)
<5> im essentially writing my own opengl w/o hardware acceleration
<5> but.. not quite; not even close
<5> Ashe what is this screenshot
<5> .. as far as i can tell every 3d engine has an object, world, and camera space, and some have sub-object spaces
<5> although you can obviously just place vertices anywhere in any space
<0> static3d_: just some project I have
<5> but the important thing out of all of this: if i had never tried this project, i would have never know how 3d *really* works
<0> The more you have spaces, the slower it's likely to be
<0> Because of all the matrix stuff
<0> If you merge spaces, it's faster
<5> yes matrix transformations are very slow
<0> They can be easily boosted with some SIMD stuff
<5> indeed
<0> But that's for the optimization part and
<0> [20:13.33] <@edcba> just do it work then optimise :)
<5> righto; get it done first
<5> you know you've been programming too much when you end all of your sentences with semicolons :P
<5> i always thought 3d programming was some black magic voodoo that would be way too overwhelming to try, but it's not
<5> and its very satisfying to see it work :D
<0> You're doing the basic stuff though
<5> you're right, but i'm learning as i'm going
<5> you gotta start somewhere
<0> Just saying it gets more complex later
<5> oh yeah with texturing, lighting, shading
<0> Nah, that's still the basic stuff
<5> well i'm not gonna write the doom3 engine by myself as a first project
<0> What you're doing is a layer below a 3D engine anyway
<0> What you might want to do is give it functions with the same name as the GL ones
<0> So you can try to compile code that'll work with it
<5> i liken it much more to a modelling program's renderer
<0> What?
<5> i mean its obviously not gonna be realtime if i keep adding stuff to it all in software, but thats my intention
<0> Should be doable
<5> i just want to get a grip on how it all really works
<0> Especially if you multithread it
<5> a lot of the old timers in like efnet #gamdev praise my determination :)
<5> because people just jump right into d3d/gl without knowing whats really going on
<5> and thats all good, but just not how i want to go about it
<0> People in efnet's #gamedev know nothing, so you shouldn't be too proud of that ;)
<0> And it's even worse in #opengl
<5> well wouldn't you agree that someone that can write a soft renderer from scratch has an advantage over someone who just knows how to use opengl
<0> Maybe for the first 5 hours
<0> I'm not saying it's bad to do it, I'm just saying people from #gamedev are clueless
<0> They wouldn't be able to write a software renderer, nor to use OpenGL properly
<5> yes i wish there was a channel dedicated to just graphics programming
<0> Or at least a channel with competent people
<0> Just check gamedev.net's forum, 99% of the people there are just kids making ugly software
<5> well there are some people in there who apparently work for GD companies
<0> And 0.5% are people looking for programmers to make a game that they designed
<0> Yes, the 0.5% left
<0> You should subscribe to gdalgorithms and such
<0> There are real programmers from real gd companies there
<5> i just like to improve my overall coding skill and knowledge, whether it seems to other people what i'm doing is useless
<0> (it looks like you don't read half of what I type)
<5> ?
<6> maybe he is right :)
<5> i habitually reinvent the wheel, because i want to know exactly how that wheel works
<0> edcba: looks like he's not reading you either
<5> maybe i got some packet loss or something ??
<5> what're you saying
<6> irc is tcp
<5> you apparently are trying to make a point? please just state it because i guess im not picking up
<7> he's all send() and no recv()
<5> you said not to listen to people in #gamedev, i got that
<5> and to listen to people on gdalgorithms
<0> nijz: heheh
<5> wtf you talking about im all recv
<5> err send
<5> i also saw the gl function names thing, yes thats a good idea
<0> That's what Mesa did, I guess
<5> so you think i should do something useful
<0> Why not
<0> It'd make it easier for you to test it too
<5> i guess its just coding practice for me and i wouldn't be confident enough in it for it to become a serious release
<0> Doesn't mean you're forced to release it
<5> yes but in that case, why not just do whatever the hell i want
<0> Because you can't use programs others made to test it?
<5> thats something i never thought about i guess
<0> It's not like I've been saying that for the past 10 lines
<7> lol
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