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Comments:
<0> and academics will have half the work they currently do!
<1> it's an interesting notion, not using paper
<1> I rather like paper, y'know
<1> not because it's more useful, but it's real
<0> reisio: well you can even use paper, but compose bibs online
<1> surely we can make paper out of soy beans or something
<0> just transform everything automatically with CSL or something
<1> I wonder if balsa is suitable for paper
<0> scientists and mathematicians basically already do that with latex + bibtex
<0> but that is a bit retrograde
<0> why bother with reading something on paper and looking up footnotes
<0> when you can read online and hyperlink direct to source
<0> http://www.brown.edu/Research/dichtung-digital/2005/2/Castanyer/Castanyer.doc
<0> edible menus from soya paper
<2> Thta's a great idea.
<1> webben: what's the doc?
<0> ?
<0> a word doc i guess
<0> just pulled the link off google
<1> webben: ...
<1> what's it about...
<0> i dunno i haven't read it
<0> just read the snippet in google
<0> crikey 10 MB
<0> must have pictures or something
<0> it's called "Aims, ingredients and history of an artistic-cultural project"
<0> and seems to be mainly about: http://www.delartsijeveux.com/
<1> webben: okay so why did you msg that link?
<0> reisio: "reisio: surely we can make paper out of soy beans or something"
<1> so you linked to a doc file on artistic-culatural stuff?
<0> yes ... because it was the only source which mentioned writing on soya paper
<0> as opposed to simply eating it
<0> the stated subject of a document does not necessarily determine the information one can glean from it
<0> _especially_ in the age of internet search
<0> reisio: i'm not quite sure what you're getting at
<1> I just wasn't sure what you were getting at
<0> reisio: the point is, in answer to your question, yes we apparently can
<1> well duh :/
<3> http://google-code-updates.blogspot.com/2006/08/announcing-tesseract-ocr.html <-- Google releases OSS OCR engine
<0> sipher: fantastic!
<0> oh, 10 years old technology
<3> ".. Tesseract is far more accurate than any other Open Source OCR package out there."
<0> sipher: yeah, open source OCR packages are pretty ****y :(
<0> "only supports the English language, and does not include a page layout analysis module (yet), so it will perform poorly on multi-column material. It also doesn't do well on grayscale and color documents"
<0> still, maybe they'll improve it
<0> Dorward: :)
<1> only supports English?
<1> wtf kind of sorry *** design is that
<1> I can't wait till I can make my own OCR program that doesn't **** total ***
<0> i wonder whether it could be thrown together with existing OS OCR libraries to make a non-****y program
<1> doubt it
<4> The "Lets not worry about accented characters" kind? The "Most documents seem to be in English so lets make English a priority" kind?
<1> that kind of limitation hints at a deep-rooted design flaw
<3> It was posted at 12:25pm.. wonder if he really posted it then or set it up so it would post then and went to bed.. to make it look like he was still up working. :D
<1> ...
<3> err.. nm
<3> pm/am.. bah
<0> I don't quite understand about this only English business.
<0> Does that mean the OCR looks for word-patterns as well as character patterns?
<4> Well, the source code is there if you want to find out the reasoning :)
<0> Yeah "/* TODO: Handle characters other than [A-Za-z0-9] */" :)
<1> it means it was designed by a monkey
<0> "It was developed at Hewlett Packard Laboratories between 1985 and 1995"
<1> they still had foreign language fonts in 1985
<0> so, it takes 10 years for a monkey to produce an OCR package
<1> hey
<1> that's a handy bit of trivia
<0> there's hope for the complete works of shakespeare yet
<1> haha
<4> reisio: So? It got dropped by HP before being finished.
<1> if it were worth anything at all, adding support for another language would be trivial and probably done already
<1> actually if it were worth anything at all, it would've supported other languages in 1985
<0> I wonder if Tesseract is used for Google Print.
<0> Those books are mostly single column and English.
<3> Anyone else notice upcoming.org uses an out of the box font for their logo? heh
<3> You'd think Yahoo wouldn't be so cheap
<1> web 2.0 is all about using preinstalled fonts :p
<1> web 2.0 kids can't be arsed to make logos from scratch
<0> why bother when you can use: http://msig.info/web2.php
<2> What's wrong with using out of the box fonts :P
<3> it's not preinstalled.. I saw the site that sells it a week or so ago. I tried to find it in my history but failed. It's $60.. and called "Ballpark" or something like that
<1> hahah, people that pay for fonts make me laughinate
<3> no.. good fonts are worth it
<1> they're worth obtaining, anyways :p
<3> How do you "obtain" a commercial font without buying it? Where the hell's the font sharing network hiding? hrm
<1> sipher: that'd be most any p2p network
<2> I don't mind paying for fonts if they are worth it.
<5> you are both under arrest for conspiring to violate copyright!
<2> I wonder if Monotype send the 'boys' round if you pinch their fonts
<1> why should they?
<1> more use of their fonts means more exposure
<0> sipher: a lot of the "1000" font bundles include copyright breakage
<0> apparently
<2> I get all my fonts from the cover-CDs of magazines :P
<1> :)
<4> reisio: Same reason that the RIAA gets upset when they find people downloading music
<1> ah, but RIAA != artists
<1> and of course music != fonts :p
<1> not a lot of people hear some music and say "oooh, I want a copy of that to use for my project"
<1> they just want it to listen to
<4> reisio: Monotype != artists either. Monotype is a company which happens to employ people to create fonts ... which they sell the rights to ... for money. And both are creative works.
<1> so RIAA employs people?
<1> (to make music)
<2> The people they represent do.
<2> They are the 'boys', for the record labels.
<4> reisio: I don't know, or care to know, much about the internals, but AFAIK the RIAA is a bunch of companies (such as Sony) who do employ people (like Robbie Williams) to make music.
<1> I guess they shouldn't get upset about pirated music, either :)
<0> i'd like to be concerned about typography, but in practice i'm more concerned about fonts not encomp***ing unicode
<0> or even sensible subsets of unicode
<3> when using google's image search, sites that break out of frames are freakin annoying
<2> I'm not sure but I think font piracy might actually hurt its respective industry more than music piracy.
<0> such fonts (most of them) aren't particularly useful for logos
<0> and if you want a logo, why not hire a graphic designer instead
<0> (that's what google did, for instance)
<2> Cost++
<0> Or at least, they pay someone to design their logos
<3> webben: Not a good one. :p Have you seen some of their original logo designs? heh
<3> Like "HAND" or whatever
<0> can't remember if he actually had a degree in design
<0> sipher: their original logos were designed by a different person
<0> One of the Google founders just liked some doodle or something by the guy who draws them currently
<0> Denis Hwang
<0> http://wk.koreaherald.co.kr/SITE/data/html_dir/2002/03/22/200203220003.asp
<0> or it wasn't a doodle, it was the logo for a particular day
<0> s/Denis/Dennis
<1> rofl
<1> someone _designed_ Google's logo? :p
<1> oh for the special day logos
<2> He designed the original one, didn't he?
<3> speaking of logo's.. look at this huge Homeland Security one I found - http://download.tsa.dhs.gov/fssa/training/images/DHS_Logo.gif
<3> heh
<3> I'm bored so I'm gonna trace it and make a vector version
<1> why would you do that...
<1> so you have a pretty logo to put on a flag when they take over the country?
<2> So you can pretend to be them and get into clubs for free, obviously.
<3> I'm gonna make a parody tee
<1> gay clubs, probably :p
<1> sipher: ah, nice :)
<3> lol
<1> should be fun to screw with their copyright/usage guidelines, too
<3> Do they even have them?
<1> undoubtedly
<1> the government likes making rules, you know
<6> i can see you
<3> well, spyemporium.com is selling straight up DHS clothing apparently so.. I don't think I have to worry. :p
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