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Comments:
<0> dad: he is correct, i'd stay away from persistent connections unless you explicitly need them.
<1> TML: and if noone here spoonfed me, and just provided a hint as to where to look for a solution, or which of the ones i have already is better ?
<2> BigE: thanks, i will read, learn.apply, repete as necessary
<3> Heh.
<2> don't need pconnect
<4> Meltir: When I report to a professor, I always include the context of the conversation.
<4> Meltir: As I said, it's not my place to judge.
<4> If it were, most of you would probably still be in 4th grade.
<5> :)
<0> TML: If you have the responsibility of hiring them, it is up to you to hire someone who is knowledgable.. not simply based on their degree. In fact, that's linked ... you hiring based on educational background and them going into IRC for tips. Easy way out on both ends.
<1> TML: the solution is simple. dont spoonfeed. sry - but by your attitude - your already judging them.
<2> TML: i wouldn't go so far as to report it, but would instead remain silent, or state that it's against my better judgement to help in such circumstances
<4> ^Artnez: educational background is a perfectly valid hiring criterion, as long as the educational system has people on both ends defending the quality of the system.
<4> ^Artnez: Just because I'm downstream of the pollution doesn't mean it's not my responsibility to help stop it.
<0> TML: educational background is a piece of paper. there is no stronger truth than that.
<6> is it possible to path of the <input type="file" /> and reinsert it while validating a form?
<7> here's the code: http://pastebin.com/576009
<1> ^Artnez: my experience exactly.
<8> Meltir: Im beginning to think this cross domain cookie thing isn't possible
<8> They dont show up in fox's cookie list
<0> TML: There are ****ty professors, ****ty students.. ****ty schools. **** is everywhere. It's like a big ****storm. The only way to wade through the **** is to have a nose for it, not read a piece of paper that says "hey, i'm not ****"
<4> ^Artnez: You can't accurately gauge someone's entire worth from a resume and an interview. There have to be standards in things like Certification and Education as guidelines to the professional world of the quality of person.
<1> Cpudan80: like i said before - i think its consered illegal by browsers.
<8> Any way I could figure out if its being blocked?
<4> Cpudan80: Meltir is right, most browsers do not allow cross-domain cookies.
<8> Hmm
<5> AfroTurf, that would be the hell of an evil ;)
<8> This isn't good then
<9> TML: and that exact narrow veiw is why the market dropped in its entirety and the value of someone with an MSCE became next to worthless and common place
<10> Computer industry certifications (other than Cisco) are worthless
<4> It's a security thing. They don't want www.evilhacker.com to set login cookies for bankofamerica.com
<8> Because these dummies gave me a very strange p***word
<6> colder: um lol
<8> that I cant change
<4> Lord_Loki: Right, because the MCSE test had no value. It was a worthless gauge.
<8> anybody know how to byp*** this?
<4> Cpudan80: You can't.
<1> TML: we are getting ahead of ourselves. asking a question on irc isnt cheeting if you dont base all your knowledge on it. if someone doesnt have an idea where to start on a more advanced/specific topic - i see nothing wrong here.
<8> Any way I can tell if its blocked?
<6> colder: i'm talking about when you browse for your file. if form validation fails, have the path in the browse box, so you don't have to browse for the file again
<8> The commands show up on HTTP headers
<9> No, what happend was kids in suburbia could get a 50-60k a year job just with that peice of paper when they knew nothing about it, so mommy and daddy put them through a crash course and they did well on the test. Doesnt mean they learned anything
<5> AfroTurf, imagine, some malicious webmaster could hide a file input, automatically filled with a path of an important file of your computer...
<0> TML: It's all about understanding the human psyche and really understanding your industry (which I know you do). You need to ask the right questions and expect very specific answers. Educational background is important, no doubt, but it's still a piece of paper. Vigilante missions aren't going to change that because that has been the way of the world since the inception of the 'educational institution'
<11> Cpudan80: cross-site cookies are NOT to be considered in any good programs
<8> Yeah
<8> The algorithm is designed to be good
<8> its designed to work
<8> lol
<9> Experience is by far the best thing you judge someone's credentials by.. There should be a portfolio for IT people.
<4> ^Artnez: I've seen people slip by with well-memorized "interview cheat sheets", and had to clean up after them.
<0> TML: All I'm saying is, if a guy gets the idea to hop into IRC and ask a question at 2:00am because they're stumped -- they don't deserve a smackdown by TML or doing so. It could screw someone over pretty bad.
<12> lol
<13> whats the function called to make straings in uppercase?
<4> ^Artnez: If those people had been kicked out of University for inappropriate behaviour, that would show up on a background check, and he'd never get to the interview stage.
<4> gimmulf: strtoupper()
<13> thanks
<9> and Certifications and Degree's (which are meaningless in and of themselves) prove nothing more than how moronic you can be to get an outdated education and spend the remainder of your life paying off your student loans
<12> because getting smacked down on IRC is such a life changing experience
<6> colder: so i take that as a no ^_^
<1> lol
<5> AfroTurf, good ***umption ;)
<0> TML: Whatever you say. I guess we'll never come to an agreement. Remember, gates doesn't have a uni diploma :)
<6> hehe ok
<8> Well - thanks for all the help guys
<8> I appreciate it
<4> ^Artnez: And Gates couldn't code his way out of a wet paper sack, either.
<0> TML: Heh. You're funny.
<0> TML: I'm sure you discover that over your morning coffee meeting with him every day.
<10> mfonda poor bastard
<9> TML: The real problem is 90% of the time, the person doing the hiring comes from a field where a degree does mean something. (ie not an IT guy) which means his perceptions of what a good IT guy is are distorted and wrong
<4> ^Artnez: Actually, he's said it himself in many interviews. "I'm no Engineer" and "I'm not a coder."
<1> ^Artnez: im sure that you know him well enough to tell us how good a coder he really is ;)
<14> Jymmm, I actually live in Bellevue, but I'm like a mile from Redmond, M$ is in walking distance
<4> Lord_Loki: I do my own hiring, and a degree should STILL mean something.
<9> What?
<12> and he isnt, he's a guy who wrote software a long time ago but is an extremely shrewd business man
<0> TML: Isn't that what every true pro says? One of the guys I idolize says that .. he's one of the most brilliant men I know.
<4> Lord_Loki: It should mean persistance; character; a desire to excel.
<9> TML: What should a degree mean? That someone has the persistance to character?
<10> mfonda: you should post signs of 'tux' along the main road on to the campus.
<9> TML: What about Military service?
<4> ^Artnez: Can you point to one line of code Bill Gates has written?
<4> Lord_Loki: Sure.
<0> Meltir: I'm not say he is or he isn't, I am saying that he's the head of pretty big goddamn company -- and at one point, he was responsible for the hiring.
<9> TML: If you want to talk about persitance and character.. Why doesnt that rate?
<4> Lord_Loki: Who said it doesn't?
<1> TML: and does it ? honestly ? have you ever hired someone without a degree that was just good at what he did, or turn down an A+ student that didnt know **** ?
<4> Lord_Loki: I've hired military.
<0> TML: It's like asking "if a tree doesnt fall, does it make a sound"
<14> Jymmm, I was at Microsoft for something one time, I wore my linux journal shirt that says something like "in a world without fences who needs gates?"
<9> TML: about 99% of the people that I interview with
<10> mfonda got dirty looks?
<4> Meltir: In some cases, it does. And if we all work together, that can become more common, until we weed out most of the problems.
<14> oh yeah
<10> lol
<4> ^Artnez: Ok, I'll grant you that, because the answer is "No"
<9> TML: I can't tell you the number of times I've been told that being in the Marines and a member of Force Recon does not show Character or Persistance and the ability to commit myself to a project. I've also been told that because the military is the way it is, that people from there do not posses the integrity needed in a business environment.
<1> ^Artnez: and hes running it well - not that i like it, but its working good for him so far. he's a buisnesman (dont know how to spell that), but not a coder.
<9> TML: The point really is, regardless of who you are, and what background you have... Certification, Education, Military, Whatever.. NOTHING, compares to experience.
<1> and experience is often gained with the help of others that already have it. like the people here.
<14> Lord_Loki, maybe true, but having a degree will make it a whole hell of a lot easier to get the job
<4> ^Artnez: You have to program to know how to program. Bill Gates doesn't code, he makes executive decisions. That's all he's *EVER* done. Bought someone else's idea and made it into a business. Is he smart? Maybe. Is he a good programmer? No, because programming is like a muscle. If you stop using it, it goes to flab. Ask dmr, or Ken Thompson, or Stroustrup, or Paul Graham, all of whom have said the same thing, or something close to it, at various points in their
<4> careers.
<9> mfonda: that I know, and that.. is pathetic
<14> this is one of my favorite articles: http://www.norvig.com/21-days.html
<9> I couldn't count the number of times I've walked into a clients office that has onstaff IT people, educated and well paid, and fixed an issue THEY could not solve after weeks of troubleshooting, in under an hour.
<4> Lord_Loki: Experience and a degree are not mutually exclusive. But if two guys with the same "experience" go up for a job, and one has a degree, we SHOULD be able to say that gives him an edge. In most Universities in the US, that's not a fair statement.
<9> TML: I would agree. But no 2 candidates have the same experience. EVER
<4> Lord_Loki: Not true.
<4> Lord_Loki: I've had many instances where, in all measurable ways, multiple clients had the same "experience"
<9> TML: by looking at their resume's?
<4> Lord_Loki: You're just pointing out the flaws in the system. I *understand* the flaws, and have my own ways of fighting those flaws, and making sure professors know where their students are getting answers is one of them.
<4> Lord_Loki: And interviews.
<15> "First I looked in the back of the book, but it wasn't an odd numbered problem. THen I asked on IRC, but they told me to RTFM. THen I finally found the answer with google."
<9> TML: but only those interviews that "make the cut" due to fitting the quota which you set, which mostly includes people with degree's no? What about the fat kid?
<4> Lord_Loki: What?
<4> You lost me there.
<9> TML: When I say the "fat kid' i am referring to the guy that lives and breathes what he does, has no real background, and only has experience to go off of.
<9> TML: ie the p***ionate
<4> Lord_Loki: I don't understand what you're asking.
<4> What about him indeed?
<0> TML: You may be right in some respects, however that doesnt make it right for you rip on people for asking repeated quesitons in IRC. I don't like asking questions in IRC much, I love playing with the idea and enjoying the feeling of doing on my own. I learned more in 1 year by doing that than any professor has ever taught me. Everyone has their own style, some people need a push -- we're all different.
<9> TML: What i am suggesting and asking, is if you look at a stack of resume's and you see some with degree's and some without, then you compare experience and decide who your going to interview,... what about the person that knows what he is doing better than all , but because he didnt make the cut due to your stipulations, you and he both miss out
<0> Just because someone is asking a stupid question in IRC does not make them a completely irrelivent individual. On the contrary, if they really wanted a quick answer, there FAR better choices than asking a random person they do not know on IRC.
<9> Ie the fat kid that sits at home and is practically married to his computer
<9> its not an anomaly
<9> its a common occurance
<16> are you calling me fat?
<16> :)
<4> Lord_Loki: I wouldn't consider "the fat kid that sits at home and is practically married to his computer" to be a good prospect for an employee.
<9> How, without an interview do you know if you are including those people?
<0> Lord_Loki: 99% of the time those fat kids have alot of problems in an office environment, or on any big projects whatsoever.
<4> ^Artnez: Precisely.
<9> And why not TML? someone who is p***ionate about what they do and they love the work??
<14> Lord_Loki, then that so called "fat kid" probably has a portfolio that speaks for itself
<4> Lord_Loki: ^Artnez pointed out just a few of my concerns.
<17> Hello, I have seen so many ways to comment out lines when programming. Can some show me the correct way to comment out the following. imagejpeg($dst_img, $dest_file, $CONFIG['jpeg_qual']);rnand replace withrnrnCode: rn $fh=fopen($dest_file,'w');rnfclose($fh);rnimagejpeg($dst_img, $dest_file, $CONFIG['jpeg_qual']);
<4> Lord_Loki: P***ion isn't something I look for in an employee. Responsibility; a history of finishing what they start; ability to work through things they might find distasteful to reach a goal; these are the things a degree USED to be about.
<0> Lord_Loki: These people are closed down invidivuals. They're not motivated enough to get a girlfriend or talk to people. Being married to your computer is VERY unhealthy from a psychological standpoint. These are the type of people that stare at the secretary like they want shtoop her, say something stupid, and get slapped in the face with a lawsuit.
<9> That, my friend, is exactly the problem. You just made a judgement without knowing anything. Suppose that person has never been IN an office environment. Suppose you dont need a "team" project cause 1 person is enough. ***umption. Is the enemy of every IT person in the world
<4> Now, it's just degree mills.
<9> P***ion does not equal lack of ability to finish or responsibilty.. your still doing it
<14> webdesign, there are three ways to comment in php: 1.) /* code here */ 2.) //line of code 3.) #line of code
<4> Lord_Loki: If they haven't been in an office environment, that's a strike against them because every employee I've ever had always has had a learning curve about learning to work that way.
<9> Artnez: Who says its unhealthy?? Society?? Please...
<18> google's got more going on than a romanian hooker
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