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Comments:
<0> reinout: which Lisp implementation are you using?
<1> cusp comes with sbcl.
<0> are you sure that complaint is actually an error?
<0> Xach: ah, thanks.
<2> it says The function MAKE-GRAPH is undefined.
<1> reinout: you need to compile and load the file that defines make-graph.
<2> (im actually using structs and not cl***es, but I thought it was not relevant to my problem)
<1> (you can also just load it)
<0> reinout: When the compiler processes a call to an undefined function, it will issue a warning, but that should not fail the compilation. However, if that function is needed at compile time (or at load time and you're loading it immediately), that will cause an error to be signalled.
<1> reinout: it's not really a good idea to start with structures instead of cl***es.
<1> reinout: structures don't support evolution of design as well as cl***es do.
<1> once the design settles, it's sometimes a good idea to switch to structures.
<2> yeah, but my situation is a bit weird. Im a second year computer science student. In the first year we learned scheme (a lisp dialect). But now for AI they gave us a project in LISP
<0> with the caveat that :type list structures are more flexible, so long as you add new slots at the end of the list
<2> and I only have a few days left
<2> so mu goal is to finish the project, rather then learning everything about lisp
<2> structs seem to work for the project we have
<2> so i rather leave it like that
<3> reinout: Re-definition of structures isn't guaranteed to work. Restart ecls with every structure change, and it'll work.
<4> Note that redefinition of cl***es is guaranteed to work, which is one of the main reasons they're recommended for new work.
<2> cool, thx. And lets say I wanted to graphicly draw something with LISP. Im using eclipse in windows. Any ideas? I just need something quick and easy, to draw lines/circles, thats it.
<5> hi
<4> reinout: I have something for putting some text in a window, does that count?
<3> reinout: You're using a really, really oddball development environment, compared to the most people. I think I'd recommend LTk, anyway, if it works with ECLS.
<3> (Most people /here/, that is.)
<4> rydis: Wait, isn't reinout using sbcl with eclipse?
<3> He said ECLS, earlier, but I'm not sure.
<3> Oh. I misread.
<3> Never mind, then. :)
<4> So it's not -quite- so oddball, but we still don't have that many people using cusp.
<4> (Or SBCL/Win32, for that matter.)
<4> vali: Yes, which makes you something like the fourth or fifth user who's a #lisp regular.
<6> hmm, i thought more people would be using it
<4> Perhaps more people are. But not in #lisp, which is mostly Linux and MacOS users.
<5> slyrus: you think i'm that kinda guy who chooses hiding? maybe you are not subscribed to slime-devel? ;)
<7> Am I a conformist then?
<3> So did many people, before it existed. The only thing hindering CL to take over the world was {SBCL/CMUCL} on Windows. Apparently that wasn't it.
<7> Is SLIME working on Windows?
<6> dsteuber: yes, it works perfectly well
<6> dsteuber: just like SBCL
<7> Perhaps Lisp is just not popular.
<8> well, CLISP did exist on windows before. :P
<9> And on Amiga, and on NeXTSTEP, etc.
<7> I guess you can measure its lack of popularity by the percentage of people who spell it CLISP or LISP ;)
<9> Try: (lisp-implementation-typ)
<9> Try: (lisp-implementation-type)
<3> foom: But that wasn't acceptable, since it wasn't free enough, not native-compiling enough, and not standards compliant enough.
<3> foom: Various of those go for ecl/gcl/corman/lww/acl and other implementations that worked on windows.
<7> That candlestick holder probably puts some people off too.
<8> rydis: yep.
<2> "SBCL" it says
<7> I mean it's not really christmas all the time.
<7> Except at south pole station.
<8> Hopefully sbcl can provide a better experience to windows users wanting to try a lisp than the others, at least in some way.
<3> dsteuber: The menorah isn't a problem. Sam Steingolds politics, however, is, to me. (But I'm silly, that way, not liking to use software written/maintained by people I dislike.)
<6> i recently switched from CLISP to SBCL because it doesn't seem to have a weird political agenda in its focus, it has a nice webpage and because there are many nice and helpful SBCL-developers here
<4> rydis: That's not so silly. I mean, look at how well it worked out for RMS.
<7> Is Sam Steingold a member of JPFO?
<3> dsteuber: JPFO?
<7> Jews For the Preservation of Firearms Ownership.
<3> I have no idea. Is there such an organization?
<7> Yes, there is.
<7> They make the NRA seem like pansies.
<10> maybe we'd get a cool ascii Mac-10 instead of a menorah if he was
<7> That would rock.
<6> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_for_the_Preservation_of_Gun_Ownership
<7> Actually, an UZI would be more appropriate.
<7> wow. An accurate wiki article.
<10> heh: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Bill_of_Rights
<0> dsteuber: I'm incredibly surprised that this article is as accurate as it is
<10> wow. that was fast.
<7> I've never signed on with the JPFO. I had a bad experience with the NRA and don't want to repeat it.
<7> Although I suppose it is possible that the JPFO and GOA are not the same as the NRA.
<7> I really think Lisp is unpopular because of the parentheses and long names. Also people seem to think it is OLD.
<0> Also because John McCarthy is a right winger.
<7> It's not like he shot anyone in the face.
<7> I didn't know that about McCarthy.
<7> RMS and ESR are the ones who are loudest about politics.
<3> dsteuber: I didn't, either. He has quote a few political texts up on his website, though, which I guess would give you a hint. ;)
<3> s/quote/quiet
<5> dsteuber: because of long names?! i hate short names, and i hated them back in the java times without the fuzzy completion, too...
<3> s/quiet/quite (I should wake up.)
<7> Well I guess someone has to counter balance the vast left wing conspiracy.
<10> also known as "facts"
<11> dsteuber: mccarthy is erh... optimistic about the future and the human race (:
<7> I guess his brain cells have finally burned out then.
<7> I will have no faith in the future until someone nukes damascus and tehran.
<10> dsteuber: watch it
<5> jsnell: are you sure about the minibuffer keymap order? M-p wants to go to the previous note for me, both in xemacs and emacs with your commit (or i screw up something, lemme double check).
<9> dsteuber: it would be safer if they converted to christianism.
<7> Sorry, a Geico commercial is on in the background.
<7> pjb, I don't think that would work or happen.
<9> Christians (and Jews) shall not kill.
<0> it would be safer if they converted to commercialism, perhaps with a thin veneer of whatever they historically belived
<7> That explains the crusades.
<7> chandler: Kind of like christmas?
<9> Crusaders went to Jerusalem to _protect_ pilgrims from muslims.
<0> dsteuber: ding.
<5> pjb: still they do... this is not that simple...
<3> dsteuber: It'd be easier to nuke Jerusalem, the Vatican and Mecca, all at once.
<9> And they were the ones to build hospitals on the way.
<7> rydis: I'm happy to add those to the list.
<7> Saudi oil might slow down after that though.
<3> dsteuber: That's good. Some incentive to not depend on cheap oil would be good for the US.
<3> But I'll be going out for a smoke, now.
<7> more air polution!
<0> Hey, let's drill in the Arctic! :-)
<7> I believe they use hot water under pressure to mine the tar sands in canada.
<0> It's too bad pfdietz isn't here.
<5> jsnell: double checked, your keymap reorder makes slime-mode-map take precedence here on gnu emacs cvs and xemacs
<0> He knows quite a lot about this stuff.
<7> Where has he gone?
<0> World of Warcraft.
<0> I think I'm going to find the store he pre-ordered Burning Crusade at and cancel his order for the good of humanity
<12> chandler: sounds like a very good idea
<7> Maybe he can run a random bug tester against WoW. Or does that violate TOS?
<7> WoW is the real life strange days, isn't it?
<7> Or would that be Everquest?"
<0> "strange days"?
<7> The movie where everyone ends up playing some VR game. IIRC.
<0> Wasn't that an episode of TNG?
<7> i wouldn't be surprised.
<13> existenz was a good take on that.
<7> I'm sure if we go far enough back, it is all based on something Phillip K **** wrote.
<0> I think I'm going to invent a fake article by Charles Babbage where he presciently predicts World of Warcraft
<0> actually, I'm sure some Neal Stephenson nut has already done that
<7> And Ada Countess of Lovelace wrote a proof of concept?
<14> Wouldn't that be a better fit for Nostradamus? You could also make it vague enough to cover all other MMORPGs
<3> In the world-as-simulation genre, I really liked _13th Floor_.
<14> rydis: Hey, is it cold in Goteborg?
<3> Maddas: Not really. It's the warmest winter since the meteorological institute started collecting measurements in 1860, apparently.
<7> Isn't global warming great?
<3> Maddas: Average temperature of +7, or so.
<14> Ah, just like everywhere else, then, rydis. :-)
<7> I don't know why people complain about it so much.
<3> maddas: You're coming here? (It's still windy and wet, though, so winter clothing is a good idea.)
<7> Maddas, can you find out about the availability of used JAS-39s from SAAB?
<14> rydis: oh, at least that ;-)
<7> The dealers here don't stock them.
<14> rydis: Yeah, I'll be at Chalmers for a little.
<0> JAS-39?
<7> A single seat jet.
<3> Maddas: Cool. Doing what?
<14> An exchange semester :)
<0> Ah. "Born from cars", I guess.
<7> Self starting, small, fly by wire, canards, very chic.
<0> Cool.
<14> dsteuber: I can ask the taxi drivers if that helps...
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