| |
| |
| |
|
Page: 1 2
Comments:
<0> gaminggeek: you there now ?
<1> Yes
<0> about those 2 months ? :)
<1> I don't know its hard to estimate something like that
<0> ofcours it's hard :)
<0> btw are you able to estimate cpu time ?
<1> O.o
<1> for compiles?S
<0> i'm planning do a lot of physical interaction ..;
<0> actually like all of it :)
<1> The best thing it to do it
<0> what ?
<0> could you rephrase that last ?
<1> the best thing to do is to make the engine
<0> hehe
<0> but i can be weeks of effort
<0> because i design this stuff like "perfect model"
<0> this means things only really work ... when they are (near) complete
<0> gaminggeek: do you know the least common devider for opengl and directx ?
<1> O.o
<1> nope
<1> talk to deltib
<0> where can i find him/her ?
<1> He should be on soon
<0> you know why i want that don't you ? :)
<0> gaminggeek: how soon is soon btw ? it's 23:23 here :)
<1> who knows
<1> could be few hours to few minutes
<0> gaminggeek: do you think i should abstract my rendering interface ?
<0> it's inrelevant to the gaming engine
<0> it's a question if one should be able to change the rendering interface
<0> like switching between opengl
<0> directx
<0> sdl etz ...
<1> just stick with opengl
<1> don't bother with directx
<1> opengl works on every platform
<0> i wont
<0> but i think one should be able to switch the interface no ?
<0> on the other hand slows down things and such
<2> is your game 2d?
<0> no
<2> then the only option is opengl ;)
<0> :)
<0> this is going to sound strange:
<0> but then i'm tied to opengl ...
<2> i don't think theres going to be any other 3d graphics APIs coming out soon
<0> ofcours not :)
<0> fydo: is there a common devider between opengl and directx ?
<2> a common divider?
<2> how about /
<0> fydo: from what i read about directx and opengl .... the common devider would be opengl
<0> fydo: the lowest api you can go and still dispatch the graphic call between directx and opengl
<2> you mean denominator?
<2> i would say ... C
<0> could be
<0> C ?
<0> like in "draw triangle" ?
<2> like in "the language"
<0> are they THAT different ?
<0> then how are some games able to switch ?
<2> well, lets use the draw triangle as an example
<0> ok please
<2> i don't want to spam the channel, so I'll just link to two tutorials i found
<0> fydo: please do so
<0> ok good
<0> "What GLQuake uses is a tiny subset of OpenGL. If GLQuake did color+normal at vertices that driver would not have been possible, since Direct3D doesn't support this."
<0> hmmm this is a compelling NOT to allow a switch ..
<2> http://www.morrowland.com/apron/tutorials/gl/gl_triangle.php
<2> http://www.robertwrose.com/d3d/tutorial3.html
<0> well it's CLEAR what deserves my PREFERNCE ...
<0> opengl is almost elegant
<0> d3d is ugly
<2> so yeah, you could abstract your graphics where your engine would supply (for example) the coordinates for the vertexes
<0> hmmm that's doable
<0> i would be abstracting there in any case ..
<2> seems like a lot of extra work that wouldn't yield much of a benefit
<2> but thats my opinion
<3> hello
<2> hi deltib
<2> Qantourisc is looking for you :P
<3> I'm not even sure I can pronounce Qantourisc let alone know why they'd be looking for me
<3> did he try looking under the bed?
<3> a lot of the time when I'm looing for something, it's under the bed
<2> hehe
<2> i know what you mean
<0> deltib: hehe ... wel fydo already answered most of the question :)
<2> oh
<0> deltib: question was: Make my engine able to switch between opengl and directx ? And if so at what abstraction level does one start to write API specific code ?
<3> heh did? you found me under the bed?
<3> well, that all depends on what kind of developer you are
<3> if you're a nice open source developer that likes portablbility you'll probably want to put API code at the lowest level in your code
<3> if you're a commercial game development company that produces windows games that eventualy get ported by LGP, then you'll probably want to write the platform dependant code so deeply into your software that some API dependant information actualy appears in the game data files
<3> although, I'm not entirely sure why you'd want to use D3D
<3> OpenGL is available on pretty much all platforms, D3D is only available on two (one of which I imagen you're not going to be supporting)
<0> deltib: open source
<0> deltib: i personally have no intention EVER to use D3d
<3> oh
<3> but you're thinking about the possibility that someone else will try to add D3D support?
<0> or software draw or whatever they wish
<0> more like a matter of courtesy rather then a real reason ...
<2> using opengl automatically provides software draw if the hardware doesn't support it
<3> narohodo
<3> fydo: I disagree
<3> I've never seen a software implimentation of OpenGL that actualy runs at any concivable acceptable speed
<2> yeah, it's super slow
<2> but it still renders
<0> :)
<2> but if you don't have 3d accel hardware, the user should be used to super low framerates ;)
<0> hehe
<3> but if you were to write your own software engine, you could get a lot more speed out of it than software GL
<0> also this would allow me to use i don't know orge3d or something and later implement it myself for example ?
<3> at the cost of image quality
<0> deltib: ofcours
<3> well, in my game engine, I've given the system what I call "surface effects" and you ***ign a surface effect to a surface (just a collection of triangles) and then a specific function is used to render that surface (each effect has it's own function)
<3> so there's one function that sets up the vector buffers for a model, and it runs through the list of surfaces in that model and calls the appropriate effect function for each one
<0> well i was also thinking in that direction :)
<3> and those are the only areas (basicly) where I have API code
<0> sweet :)
<3> of course, it'll require a lot of code, since there is a function for every case (and in some cases more than one function)
<3> but the alternative is one function with a whole lot of tests in it, which could really slow things down
<0> so use some api directly or use some sort of ogre3d / crystalspace / ...
<0> aldo i've yet to encouter one i like ...
<2> yeah, but you can test for those kinds of things on init, no?
<0> fydo: init ? test ?
<3> I am using an API directly, I'm using OpenGL
<3> fydo: not really
<0> i would just make sure the user can enable and disable all these feature
<3> I'm talking about the kinds of tests that decide how the rendering is set up, and you have to change that for every object you render
<2> Qantourisc: you can query the card to see what extensions it supports
<0> so he can select what his gpu ca ndo
<2> deltib: ah i see
<3> but, my method is sort of like that
<3> you decide on load which function a surface needs, and stick a function pointer in there
<3> actualy, I'm thinking of making it even faster by loading each function up into a display list, so then instead of calling a fuction, you just call the display list
<0> deltib: so basicly you have "material" "triangle" and ask your render api to draw that ?
<2> a single function in a display list is faster than just the single function?
<3> eh?
<0> deltib: thanks ... but i should be getting to bed now ...
<3> it's faster than a function full of GL function calls
<2> oh, i see. i was under the impression that you were just putting a single GL call in a display list for the purposes of speed
<0> "display list" ?
<2> Qantourisc: you should pick up the opengl red book
<2> i think the first edition is available for free (legally)
<0> seems to be if this is a common term
<3> it's a GL thing that allows you to create a list of GL commands, and then you can just call those commands all at once with a single function call
<0> OOOO
<0> sweet :)
<3> I asume in a good hardware implimentation the display list would be stored in video memory, which would save a lot of time too
<0> night and thanks for the help
Return to
#lgp
or
Go to some related
logs:
#perl
#gentoo
#ubuntu
baby picutres
#python
gnomebaker eating cpu
/usr/lib/qt3/bin suse 10
#linux
3gpwiz+ubuntu
smartmontools d810
|
|