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Comments:
<0> yo
<1> hmmm anyone know if it's possible in xorg.conf to specify two mice, one being left handed the other being right handed?
<2> simosx: coming to Boston?
<2> keithp: can you make it we schedule a meeting for the two days before Boston Summit?
<3> keithp: ping
<4> behdad: two days before?
<4> behdad: I could certainly do one day before
<2> keithp: waldo sent out the list, scheduling it on the summit. so, doesn't matter
<4> ok
<2> keithp: so, you added this scan target
<4> that's what I thought
<4> yes
<4> look interesting?
<2> keithp: do you feel like adding a generic target?
<2> yeah, indeed
<4> what's a 'generic' target?
<2> keithp: it's about generic families, sans, serif, etc.
<4> Oh, you want to know if a name is generic
<2> keithp: so you <match target="generic"> <edit ...
<4> I think that's just a config variable
<2> keithp: I want to get the list of generics
<4> yes
<2> umm
<4> I think that's just <generic>blah-blah</generic>
<2> I see...
<2> right, right.
<4> Then you can do FcConfigGetGenerics (config)
<2> is there such a thing already?
<4> No
<2> ok
<4> But, I've already bumped the .so version, so adding API is 'free' at this point
<2> so, do you think this can be done soonish?
<2> ah
<2> right
<2> that solves a lot of problems
<4> behdad: does english support introspection?
<2> allows for font grouping, etc.
<2> huh?
<4> Font grouping?
<2> keithp: like font dialogs that instead of listing all families, list Sans, Serif, Favorites, Poster Fonts, ...
<4> ok, just as long as you're not talking about 'my fonts' and 'smith project fonts' yet
<2> keithp: so you add <generic>Favorites</generic><alias ...
<2> keithp: it's all user configuration
<4> I think I need more information; can you put together what you want and how it relates to the existing configuration?
<4> In email?
<4> Along with code?
<2> keithp: ok
<2> keithp: sample code or patch? ;)
<2> keithp: do you have a timeline for the release?
<2> I can't hack on fontconfig until at least next week
<2> but I'll send a mail right away
<4> behdad: I'd like to get 2.4 out soon, we can talk about what features 2.5 needs though
<4> Along with fixing the matching system so it goes reasonably fast
<2> keithp: also, can one make a font not show up in FcFontList but used otherwise (as an alias, etc)
<2> keithp: yeah, sounds good.
<4> Aliases don't show up in FcFontList
<4> Only "real" names do. That's mostly to protect trademarks
<2> keithp: i know. I meant hiding real names
<2> real renaming...
<4> behdad: the new scan target can do that
<2> I'll better dump my questions into a mail :)
<2> right...
<2> nice
<4> Qt is losing badly anyway; they route around fontconfig too much
<4> At least they're using it for the font database; it could be worse, I guess
<5> behdad I was just thinking about you:)
<2> :)
<5> I was thinking about proposing a standard that instead of changing keyboard layout you could change input langauge and that will change other things like spell checking and the like as well
<5> I think I told you about it already no?
<5> anyhow I was wondering, how come there is not system wide spell checker on unix?
<5> isn't it something that can be done in low enough level?
<5> in the end you can get the text from the keyboard or from the X window no?
<5> keithp is it completly crazy to think about x extension that allows you to do text filtering?
<2> nakee: humm, spellcheckers probably don't have an X connection, so...
<4> nakee: text filtering? X isn't all that interested in text...
<5> oh
<5> so how do windows/macos spell check?
<5> just because it's the widget?
<5> maybe in xlibs window definions then?
<5> there must be some way to do it without being widget set dependent
<6> each app brings own spell checker
<6> otoh, mac has something called services, i think spell checkers can work with that, and in unix it seems some apps go with aspell
<5> UnNamed services that do what?
<6> nakee: services is the name of the thing
<6> nakee: taken from nextstep
<7> nakee: have you checked lib***y?
<3> nakee: there are system wide spell checkers for unix
<3> nakee: it just so happens that there are many more than one
<5> dobey no, you have the same code implemented in each widget set
<3> nakee: no, you have N backends and N widget sets, and optimally, they all need to work together... do the math :)
<5> felipec checked what about it?
<5> felipec it uses enchant if I remember right
<6> nakee: libaspell is a lib
<3> nakee: "aspell" or "ispell" are system-wide. they care not about the widget set
<5> dobey but each widget set need to call them
<3> nakee: yes. whether you have one API or twenty APIs, each widget set is still going to have to connect to something to make it work
<3> you're not going to get rid of that
<5> dobey sure, I just wonder if what calls it can be done in low enough level that it would be shared by all widget sets
<7> nakee: the ***ySpellEntry... I thought it was something more generic =/
<5> dobey same thing like how you change keyboard layout
<5> dobey I want to be able to change input language
<7> nakee: I think it's a good idea... actually I switch to LAm to type in spanish, and it would be great if also the spellchecker switches to spanish
<3> nakee: if you want to share things across the widget sets, you need to make the widgets use enchant. that is what enchant is for. that won't get you change of input language though
<3> you need to do that separately through the input method infrastructure i guess.
<5> dobey that's the complicated way to do thing, users want to change one thing not 10
<3> felipec: ***ySpellEntry is just a GtkEntry that uses enchant for spell checking, if enchant is installed
<5> gtk-spell doesn't even use enchant in stable version..
<7> dobey: I see... is there a libenchant home page? Google doesn't seem to find it that well
<3> nakee: you're talking as a developer, not as a user. i didn't say you had to have 10 UIs for it. I said you might have ot integrate 10 things better to amke it work
<3> felipec: it's on freedesktop
<5> felipec it's on fd.o wiki
<5> felipec and there is another one under abiword.com/enchat or so
<3> nakee: you're just oversimplifying the problem to "i want to do this 1 thing", and not looking at the part where to do that, N other things need to happen in the background
<5> dobey fine, but then again you need kde/xfce/gnome/wherever else all implement it
<3> nakee: yes. and you are going to have to have qt, gtk+, fltk, and whatever widget set, all implement it, no matter what you do
<5> dobey but if for example there is a way to implement it in xlib level then suddenly they all will have support to it
<3> nakee: no
<5> why not?
<3> xlib doesn't know anything about gtk+ or qt widgets
<5> it doesn't need to
<3> where is the red squigly lines going to come from?
<3> where is the UI for correcting spelling going to come from?
<3> it has to be in the widgets
<3> it's not going to automagically work if you abstract it into xlib
<3> you still have to make the widgets use it
<3> and i see no need for it to be in xlib
<3> or depend on X
<3> what about ncurses for example
<3> surely spell checking in vim would be useful
<3> and integrated with the system. you don't want different methods for vim and gedit, just because one is a console app
<8> that'd work if you ran it in an X terminal, and misspelling support was built in to X ;-)
<3> only if the terminal supported it
<3> and knew what to do in the app running in the terminal
<8> nah, you could gross hack it to work whenever text was rendered
<8> but it'd be the worst idea ever invented
<3> you'd need some correction method still.
<8> true
<7> dobey: spellchecking in console apps with the same interface as GUI appws would be great
<3> and i'm sure the terminal isn't going to have hacks to handle proper input for every possible console app :)
<7> but that doesn't change nakee's argument... XInput or whatever could use that interface too
<3> i'm not saying it does change nakee's argument
<3> i'm just saying there's a lot more to consider than the single "i want spell checking and language input selection to work together"
<3> ie, all the things that have to work together to make that happen
<7> btw, a search for "enchant" on fd wiki's didn't return anything
<3> felipec: it's under the software page
<5> dobey ok, then maybe doing it the other way around, the window will know what language is going to be inputed every widget set could ask about it and do what ever it needs to do
<3> felipec: wiki search stuff always ****s.
<5> http://www.abisource.com/enchant/
<3> nakee: the other problem of course, is that the input method only specifies character set, not language, i think. there's a lot of work that needs to be done to make what you want, work right
<7> dobey: yeah... I wish the wiki could be updated
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