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Comments:
<0> that doesn't give them the right to break the law, bmc
<1> sintient: who was?
<2> break the law
<1> lol
<1> ****
<3> Kaliuna: they have been sometimes, you know
<4> Jefferson.
<5> Doc -- no
<4> I mean wouldn't that be against nigerian law?
<6> no, but their "legislative duties" are protected
<3> Kaliuna: that's why appeals are so frequent
<1> sintietn: jesus
<4> Or conspiracy to break nigerian law?
<3> and decisions are reversed frequently
<5> Doc -- with the evidence of the video and the tape -- I don't think the judge was wrong...
<0> you guys seem to be confusing "congressmen" with "foreign diplomats"
<6> communication and documents, and even the operations
<1> sintient: was he helping Mugabe?
<4> I don't think so.
<3> Kaliuna: I don't think so either
<2> excellent
<3> Kaliuna: but we're speaking theoretically
<6> occ2 http://www.rules.house.gov/Archives/jcoc2af.htm#16
<4> Is that the zimbabwe leader?
<5> Doc -- reasonable evidence...
<4> He is a bad dude.
<1> sintient: ooh Nigeria...killing each other with their corruption
<7> Doc
<3> occ: no
<1> Nigeria/Zimbabawe, hate each otehr
<1> both corrupt
<4> Well they were doing a deal and someoen wanted jefferson to send him cash for a bribe.
<3> different kinds of immunity for different situations
<5> Doc -- well can't really speak theoretically with that much to go on -- probable cause
<4> BUt jefferson never sent it.
<7> Doc
<4> He like did a fake bribe.
<0> what am i looking at, here, bmc?
<8> he was holding it for a friend, yeah, that's it, that's the ticket
<6> er
<4> He told the fbi undercover that he already sent the money, but it was in his freezer.
<3> Kaliuna: the point is that what applies to a simple citizen may not apply to the papers in a Congressional office ... a higher leve of scrutiny is in order
<6> occ2 http://www.rules.house.gov/Archives/jcoc2af.htm
<4> Well if you believe some of the fbi tapes why don't you believe that part?
<2> stop consuming media
<4> And if he was given 100k from an fbi agent andhe bribed someone how could it be in his freezer?
<2> interact with things in a natural way
<4> only like 20k, his cut, would be there.
<9> Jefferson is "movin' on up"
<3> Kaliuna: if he's hiding non-congression papers in his office you still have to be careful not to compromise the other papers during your search
<9> to the East side
<5> Doc -- sorry but they are NOT above the law... besides they don't own the offices, we the people own the offices
<9> he finally got a piece of the pIEEEEEEee
<4> What is the charge for taking money to bribe someone and then stealing it?
<4> OMG I have the best spin on this.
<0> now, wait
<3> Kaliuna: I think you're missing the point
<0> are members of congress exempt from *all* federal laws?
<6> no
<4> <spinmaster> Jefferson was actually stopping the bribe from happening by just saying he would do it and taking the money, he is a great american"
<2> advance in deployment management
<3> Kaliuna: I agree he should not be able to avoid prosecution by hiding non-congressional business in with his congressional papers
<6> look at this part though
<4> A congressman can't be arrested for misdeameanors.
<10> Kaliuna -- hether a court finds that the items seized from Jefferson's office were related to such protected legislative activities as writing, researching and voting on bills.
<5> Doc -- they were "very careful"
<6> The other constitutional concern, separation of powers, arises since administrative enforcement of Federal EEO and labor laws is generally vested in executive agencies. Allowing an executive agency to enforce these laws against Members of Congress might, in some situations, violate the Court's separation of powers standards
<4> Felonies are fair game and breaking the peace.
<3> Kaliuna: bug in the process of searching a higher level of security procedures are in order
<2> ------------------------------------------------------------>****ie greenleaf
<10> Kaliuna -- They were very careful not to allow any oversight
<0> this is talking about their lack of liability based on the laws they ennact, not based on personal or professional misconduct
<3> bmc: why are you repeating? that wasn't pertinent the FIRST time you posted it
<5> AAA -- thats what they said....
<4> Did you guys like my theory of the spin that is coming?
<3> occ: exactly
<2> eat my daphodils but not my posies
<4> Seriously what is the charge to just stealing bribe money?
<3> sintient: disorderly conduct is a misdemeanor and it is specifically listed as something they can be arrested for
<10> Kaliuna -- safeguard the independence of Congress against executive branch intimidation, of the kind the Founders had witnessed under King George III's colonial governors, and har***ment from private lawsuits.
<6> OcDoc the reasoning they state isnt limited to those two cases, its because of enforcment of that law is done by the executive allowing them to enforce it on congress might in some situations be a violation, how isnt that "pertinent"
<4> Well breaking the peace on congress floor is one thing.
<4> Like going nuts or playing music to screw up the proceedings.
<5> Congress critters are all in a dither -- good - let them be, if they think they can hide criminal wrongdoings by putting them in their offices--
<2> i think ketchup is a good substitute for blood
<0> what percentage of the house do you think is crooked?
<0> i bet 5%
<3> bmc: because it has nothing to do with an individual committing a crime
<2> captain occ toots his horn and swings his wheel
<2> occ, you mean legally?
<3> bmc: the protection is for congress, not for an individual congressman
<0> redfish: <non-sequiter>
<5> AAA -- it doesn't cut the mustard on this - you know it - so stop trying to cover up for it...
<9> cap'n redfish swings his hips and toots his "cigar"
<6> its not suppose to, it has to do with the standards theyre using to decide whether or not something is privileged
<11> So this congressman at the center of this thing is one of Jefferson's decendents?
<0> yeah, legally, redfish
<6> its not suppose to be a direct precedent
<6> there isnt a precedent
<10> Kaliuna -- search warrant for Jefferson's office and the raid to execute it were unprecedented in the 219-year history of the Constitution.
<2> usmale crawls on his back
<12> AAAman you'd back down off that statement quicker than a greased turd if the roles were reversed and it was tom delay being investigated under a dem president, and you know it
<0> welp, tough ****
<0> the precedents, they are-a changin'
<3> bmc: his congressional papers are privileged ... evidence of a crime he committed is NOT privileged
<2> fully schematize XML!
<0> new precedent: the FBI *can* raid your ****.
<4> So do you think you would be defending delays officec material?
<4> Saying it was unprecedented.
<10> bud -- DeLay was indicted
<5> AAA -- so? its about time we started holding these congress critters to the same standards as they hold the citizens...
<3> bmc: the only thing left to decide is how to go about protecting the congressional papers while searching for the evidence
<13> next precedent: meet the new Gestapo
<4> What is good for the gander is good for the goose.
<9> Jefferson is a crook, AAAman is wrong, & the Republicans are wrong
<9> there. Simple.
<6> OcDoc yes, i figured there would be a process
<2> there are exactly three people in this channel who are transgendered individuals
<5> AAA -- so what?
<0> yah, im terrified that this will go "too far"
<10> bud -- At least treat him like Delay
<2> and all of them are us-male
<12> AAAman that neither here nor there for the sake of argument. you know whats up
<0> searching congressional offices -- its like 1984!!
<0> its not like it was a lark, lest we forget -- this guy is guilty, period, they've got it all on tape
<0> to say there was probable cause for a search is quite an understatement
<3> folks, it IS possible to commit a crime before you've been convicted of it
<10> GOP allowed DeLay remain until indicted. That is fair?
<12> AAAman for as high a standard as you've held republicans up to for the last several months you sure have changed clothes for Jefferson.
<4> Who listens to pelosi anyway?
<6> the rules say when indicted he had to step down
<12> bmc, party rules, yeah
<2> how much power is required to eat through a lady bug
<10> bud` -- First, I never stated anything about DeLay other than he would be indicted. Give it up
<10> bud -- You should only hold Jefferson to the same standard
<12> AAAman no i wont give it up, I love it. watching you change colors
<12> f'in hack
<4> No AAA is pretty consistent.
<14> No he's not
<4> He isn't idicted yet he can do what he wants.
<10> bud -- I rarely prejudge someones guilt
<2> different strokes rule the world
<4> He is likely up to something bad.
<10> Bud-- I favor the judical process
<15> Someone's gonna have to explain the plot of Lost to me
<4> But he thinks he can do his job.
<9> hahaha
<2> birds of a feather flock together
<12> AAAman pull the other one
<5> AAA -- and has there been a trial in Delay's case?? seems most have been dropped
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