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Comments:
<0> cuz all the signs say "THIS IS MARY'S HOUSE"
<1> ah, of course.
<2> did washington sleep there?
<2> or clinton? ;)
<0> no but John was there
<2> a john, or "john the baptist?"
<0> no the other john
<0> not the baptist guy
<2> john valjean? ;)
<0> one of the 12 disciples, dummy
<2> or john the bible writer?
<0> mary went with him to turkey
<0> they probably had ***
<2> how did you know my intrafamilial nickname???
<1> sounds like a convenient myth espoused by Empress Helen of Byzantium
<0> lol
<0> myth?
<0> are you nuts
<2> mythter and mythus legend
<0> you believe the rest of the myths, but you find it implausible that she lived in turkey, when m***ive evidence exists??
<1> panini: no, I'm just wondering what the basis is for knowing it
<0> that's ilarious
<3> http://www.hoystory.com/wp-content/uploads/CheneyKill.jpg
<1> what's the m***ive evidence?
<0> well, the house
<2> turkey seems a long way from bethlehem
<0> it's still there
<2> even the other bethlehem
<1> http://www.kusadasi.biz/virginmary2.asp
<2> the northern one
<0> well then petition the turkish govt and tell them to stop deceiving tourists
<1> I'm just wondering what the evidentiary basis is
<1> if any
<0> hang on, i think i have pics
<3> bloggers starting to think the abramoff photo is faked.
<3> http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1158908,00.html
<3> his head may have to be like 6" tall in that photo
<1> like, Helen built a lot of churches commemorating various events in Jesus' life, without really knowing if the place where they were built.. actually were where the events occurred
<0> yeah i took pics of her house
<1> The resolutions of the council of 431 held that the Virgin Mary came to Ephesos.
<0> http://hilbertspaces.com/photos/turkiye/ephesus.html
<0> this pic is kinda blurry, but it was taken INSIDE mary's house: http://hilbertspaces.com/photos/turkiye/DSCN0424.JPG
<1> The Ionians led by Androcles established a city here in the 11th century B.C. On a nearby hill was a Temple to the goddess of fertility Cybele, later identifed with Artemis
<0> this is mary's house from the outside: http://hilbertspaces.com/photos/turkiye/DSCN0423.JPG
<1> hm, originally the home of a pre-Christian mother goddess
<1> how conveeenient
<0> yes, i saw the temple of artemis too
<2> like you two are gonna finally clear up a centuries old debate
<0> no, it's not in the same place
<0> the temple of artemis is several miles away
<0> AND temple of artemis was one of the original 7 wonders of the world
<1> same city, though
<0> but mary's house wasn't
<1> hey glo
<0> uh yeah
<0> but still far apart
<0> and far apart in time too
<4> hello
<0> several centuries
<2> day glo :)
<2> g'day glo hehe
<2> could you tone it down a tad? ;)
<0> yes, 1000 years apart
<2> graci
<4> what are 1000 years apart?
<2> timur's earsa
<0> and she definitely was not a virgin when she came to ephesus
<2> ears
<1> which just makes the correlation all the more interesting
<2> he's that lagged!
<0> remember, the whole virgin thing was just a MISTRANSLATION, much later
<0> nobody back then thought she was a virgin
<2> who were mary's parents, aka jesus' grandparents?
<4> true
<2> are they ever mentioned anywhere?
<2> or joseph's?
<4> don't try that on CptKirk, he's up to his armpits in the most irrational dogma
<1> Abu Mariam and Ema Mariam
<4> Cpt_Kirk that is
<1> ;)
<2> huh?
<2> she wasnt a virgin when she conceived jesus?
<0> and yeah she probably porked John
<1> While it is known that the bible never mentions her being a virgin (mistranslation from the hebrew, the word is "young" and differs by a letter) this fact is often disregarded by the Roman Catholic Church and Christianity as a whole.
<2> poor joseph
<1> http://www.carm.org/diff/Isaiah7_14.htm
<2> but her not being a virgin, how would anyone know that back then if she didnt become pregnant from previous forays?
<0> there was no reason to think she was a virgin, she never claimed it, nor did anyone else
<2> cant ***ume just cuz young was mistranslated into virgin that she wasnt a virgin
<0> lol
<4> well, the roman catholics are a little whacky, having far more cloistered homo***uals than the general population
<4> they apparently need to imagine things
<0> now there's the sign of an illogical thinker!
<2> youre ***uming because of a mistranslation theyre hiding something?
<2> thats a leap
<2> no, not at all
<2> what evidence can you present that she wasnt?
<0> wrong question
<1> not 'hiding'
<1> just maintaining a linguistic mistranslation long-ensconced
<2> you cant tell me that due to a mistranslation it automatically makes her not a virgin
<2> or even "likely" she wasnt
<0> you know, Ephesus was a real happenign city back then
<2> hehe
<1> Word actually used in Hebrew scriptures is "almah" (="young woman").
<1> Hebrew word which could have been used, but wasn't, was "bethulah" (="virgin").
<2> i forgot
<2> the lack of using the word means absolutely nothing
<0> listen dumb***, the WHOLE NOTION of her beign a virigin arose only because of a mistranslation
<1> it does, actually.
<0> are you really that dumb?
<2> just cuz i never ascribed the word "nice" to you doesnt mean youre not
<2> or does it?
<1> hence, exigesis
<1> no, we're not talking about 'a' word in one language, but the choice of two possible words then translated.
<2> the notion may have srisen from mistranslation, but that alone doesnt prove she was not
<0> the bible also does not mention that mary was a space alien. so according to Linus' "logic", you have ***ume that she was a space alien
<0> lol
<2> my logic?
<2> YOUR LOGIC
<0> yup
<2> goddamn
<0> and I use the term lightly
<2> im not the one positing such a fallacy
<0> you certainly are
<0> that's why we laughed at you
<2> no, you are suggesting she wasnt a virgin with no other backing than an adjective describing her was mistranslated
<0> because you made a really elementary mistake
<1> the fact that the word which specifically meant virgin was *not* used means something.
<2> i did? you cant provide any other evidence, can you?
<1> that's a basic ***umption in exigesis generally.
<2> timur, and how many other adjectives were not used?
<0> you can't provide ANY EVIDENCE that she wasn't a space alien either
<1> 'space alien', say.
<0> so you are forced to believe that she was
<2> funny, the adjective promiscuous wasnt used either
<1> we're speaking to ones that could have been used similar in meaning but not.
<1> right, afaik no one's arguing for her promiscuity
<4> there are also dogmatic priests in the RC establishment who insist that Jesus had no brothers and sisters
<2> i dont see how "young" being translated into "virgin," intentionally or not, tells me anything about her real state at that time
<4> which is inane because the bible itself mentions them
<4> younger brothers and sisters, as he was the first born
<0> that's right, you don't see
<2> nice circular argument panini
<0> gloriae: you can insist anything you want, just hold a council and decide it
<1> Linus: if a word which specifically means virgin was deliberately not used, vs. one that really means 'young woman', then that means something. I.e. that they didn't intend for her to be seen as a virgin.
<4> not me, panini, I don't get to participate in roman catholic priestly catholic discussions
<2> tim, then we agree to disagree
<4> anywhere near that, I'm on the cook, clean and garbage detail
<0> "I declare Mary to be a Space Alien, by the council of 1256!"
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