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Comments:
<0> pmo - bull****
<0> france push their weight around just as much as they can
<1> sintient, do you think that "LOL" makes your point?
<2> Eye witnesses are notoriously faulty.
<0> they just sulk they dont have as much weight as the US
<3> pmo: really. Well, Sarkozy seems to need help.. :)
<4> oh yeah? lol!
<2> I know that your "I think" doesn't prove your point.
<5> Levski, why you mean they made a war ? to circumvent terrorism issue.. ?
<6> Denis Boyles on the French is very funny and, imnsho, very accurate
<1> sintient, eye witnesses are notoriously faulty? How so?
<0> pmo - half the EU was there with them..
<2> http://agora.stanford.edu/sjls/Issue%20One/fisher&tversky.htm
<1> sintient, are you suggesting that tsunami victims are not trustworthy?
<4> TT: yeah that's why they are considered so solid in helping convict a person in court.
<5> Levski, weight.. weight of france.. if they didn't have some real good arguements.. their weight wouldn't go far.. i wouldn't say the same with the US gov
<2> You are taking one issue.
<6> so if some people are grateful for us aid and not particularly impressed with french aid they ... don't count. of course!
<2> And you actually didn't post any quotes from tsunami victims.
<4> TT: hey if anyone actually saw it, then they are probably "unreliable"
<4> see
<2> You just expressedan opinion.
<1> sintient, answer the question.
<0> real good arguments? they storm out of meetings because people talk english because of french
<6> because they're just eyewitnesses and as such notoriously faulty
<2> I don't know what quotes are you talking about?
<0> thats hardly a real good argument
<4> why, yes
<2> Post some so I can check the source.
<1> sintient, are you suggesting that tsunami victims are not trustworthy?
<6> they don't have the credibility of a bunch of leftoids staying up all night agreeing with each other
<2> What victims?
<2> You have any in particular you want to discuss?
<1> sintient, did you see any footage of presidents Bush and Clinton in the tsunami zone?
<4> gloriae: while having not seen a damn thing, makes one reliable! Perfecto =)
<2> Or am I supposed to make a blanket statement about people on a m*** media clip that you won't post a link to?
<5> this is what was said at the time.. a few days before the war, by the french authorities --> DOMINIQUE DE VILLEPIN, Minister for Foreign Affairs of France, ../.. His Government did not subscribe to what might be the other objectives of a war, he said. As to a regime change in Baghdad, while no one underestimated the cruelty of that dictatorship, that was not the objective of resolution 1441. And force was certainly not the best
<5> way to bring about democracy. It would encourage dangerous instability, there and elsewhere. As for fighting terrorism, war would only increase it, and the world would then be faced with a new wave of violence. As for remolding the political landscape of the Middle East, doing so ran the risk of exacerbating tensions in a region already marked by great instability. ../.. 07th march /2003 http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs/2003/
<5> sc7682.p2.doc.htm
<4> because of course, any witness is "involved" and therefore biased. Total ignorance is preferred.
<2> I just posted a link to polls some favorable some not, and thetailor didn't.
<1> sintient, you lame ****, answer the question.
<7> Are not the Muslims in the the Tsunami regions generally happy with the efforts of the US? Or have I not kept up with news offerings here in the states?
<2> That is the bottom line.
<2> Answer my question "What tsunami victims?"
<0> obviously the ones that didnt die
<2> Still that is just one topic.
<1> sintient, you posting anything doean't have bearing on the question of wether eye witnesses are trustworthy.
<2> You are asking me to make a blanket statement.
<2> Why should I?
<2> Post some specifics and I wills study them and give you an answer.
<6> and pbs has long been trying to be as french as it can ;)
<3> pmo: right, that accords with the general European view as stated in points 1-3 as above
<6> i.e. ungrateful, dishonest, hypocritical, etc
<3> but that doesn't make it valid for the world or the US
<8> man, i have no idea how I lived before USB thumbdrives
<1> Blanket statements? Like eye witnesses aren't trustworthy?
<9> Lupine: hehe
<3> I don't have one and have no problem.. :)
<0> europe has convinced itself its the centre of all things enlightened i think
<9> Lupine: used to be when we went to jobs we'd carry a cd book w/ programs, etc
<9> basic utiities, etc
<3> brb, breakfast
<8> l0c0: yep
<9> now...its nice to just carry 1 or 2 gb drive and have everything i need on there
<2> I mean are all katrina victims honest?
<6> whoa, one of the defense attorneys in that case is the wife of carlos the jackal?!?
<8> That is one thing I love bout these dell monitors.. UBS2.0 hub, build in card reader, etc.
<5> Levski, at least i still personaly wait to be convinced.. that iraq war was the way to go, and end islamoFascism
<8> the onthing i wish it had, was firewire hub
<6> incontheivable
<0> pmo - im still to be convinced the US should put bush in court
<6> whom she married after his conviction
<8> pmo: we live in a represenative democracy.. the elected officials do not have to personally appease every single citizen.
<1> sintient, we weren't taling about US persons, we were talking about persons around the world and what they think of the US.
<6> "The public prosecutor was unable to provide proof that a chemical attack was planned, although police seized a protective suit, and chemicals including the highly toxic substance, ricin."
<6> uh HUH
<2> I have never even met a pakistani so how can I make a statement like that.
<9> Lupine: they need to appease the ones that make the biggest donations
<9> :-)
<1> sintient, so stick to the discussion at hand, don't muddle it as you did earlier.
<2> I posted a link to questions posed to people in countries all around the world and you said you didn't trust PBS.
<0> where do you live that a pakistani doesnt own the local store?
<0> antartic?
<2> so I asked you to post the surveys you trusted and you still haven't.
<5> Levski, is all right.. i just try to argue.. but i would always agree to disagree.. in fact.. i don't expect to convince you, one way or another.. you'll do yourself.. if you find my arguments relevant..
<9> not a lot of pakistanis here
<1> sintient, it's very lame for you to muddle the discussion, there is a cure for that, keep that in mind.
<2> How come you don't have to answer my requests for your facts?
<9> big syrian business community though
<2> But you kick me for wanting actuals facts to study?
<1> sintient, I don't need to do your research for you, I gave my opinion as to what the world thinks of the US.
<2> But when I said over 100 congressman voted against the war you asked me to prove it.
<2> You said I made the claim and I had to prove it.
<1> sintient, again, I don't have to prove or do research for you.
<2> Now you made the claim about victims of tsunamis and pakistanis now you back it up.
<2> You don't even do research for your own arguements.
<1> sintient, as I said earlier, I gave my opinion.
<0> pmo - if we want to argue about how places are seen.. i live in north cyprus under a full embargo.. in 2004, after a referendum, france and its european friends promised to end our isolation.. they lied... the US made no such promises and yet went ahead with direct trade with us anyway.. you can make your own guesses about how i feel about europe and the US
<2> And I posted real polls that proved you wrong and you kicked me.
<2> I got yah.
<6> TheTailor : you lack credibility with sintient because of your lack of eagerness to make things up
<10> sintient, you are devoiced (Requested by TheTailor - Reason: Lame childish argument )
<6> excellent point, Levski
<1> Polls prove nothing
<5> Lupine, well Allies.. fake WMD.. 50% dems.. who may back such allegation.. and i don't comment about republicans.. making up their point of view about the bush administration.. doesn't sound that much of a "very single citizen allegation".. and i suppose they'll be much interested, like i am.. what lead us in this war ? bush shouldn't mind that much after all.. if he had real good reason to do so...
<1> pmo, 'fake' WMD? You meant that gas that killed the Kurds was fake? The DECLARED stocks weren't really there?
<11> 99 out of 100 lemmings surveyed said the cliff is not very high
<6> lol Null_Ptr
<5> Levski, seems relevant.. of mixing cases.. to me.. discussion didn't start with this, at the first place.. but may explain a biases position
<5> TheTailor, when was it ?
<8> Tailor: typical leftoid spin :-)
<1> pmo, when was what?
<5> TheTailor, was it used against the kurds ?
<8> pmo: i understand that this may be difficult for you to comprehend but: the UN documented WMD. It was Saddam's duty to not only destroy them, but DOCUMENT their destruction. He never did that.
<1> pmo, like sintient, you can do your own research for that.
<8> either saddam hide/moved the WMD, or he destroyed it yet did not document it. Either way, he failed his obligations.
<11> Lupine we didn't justify to the UN and the american people we were going to invade Iraq because he destroyed the weapons but didn't fill out the paperwork.
<11> Lupine we alleged he had weapons.
<8> Null: if he can not prove he destroyed them, it is shere folly to not act as if he had them.
<8> in any event, there was a wide range of justification given. it's just leftoid spin to ignore those as well
<11> there was no "wide range" of justification given
<11> there was one justification given
<0> pmo - the US is the hegemony.. they did what they wanted to do.. just like every other empire did what it wanted to do when it was able to.. just as you continue to do in parts of africa
<11> the other post-facto justifications apply evenly to almost every country out there we don't like such as iran, north korea, etc
<0> why are you surprised or offended by this i dont know
<11> and are not the reason we went in, for the simple observed reason that we ONLY went into Iraq
<8> Null: that is another ignorant leftoid spin, to act they are post-facto justifications, when they actually occured PRIOR to the invasion.
<4> Null_Ptr: that's totally false. Many "reasons" were mentioned
<4> also, "he had weapons". That's completely factual
<8> US: i just love how desperate they are, that they have to deny basic facts :-)
<4> Lupine, seems so yeah
<11> "mentioned" is a pretty low bar
<8> October 7, 2002 http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/10/20021007-8.html
<11> we have "mentioned" lots of things
<11> that doesn't mean a war is justified
<4> not only mentioned but given widely in all major media outlets
<4> anyone who decided to ignore all "other reasons" is at fault for that
<8> closing down terrorist camps in Iraq.. freeing the Iraqi's from Saddam, etc.. all laid out in multiple speeches prior to invasion
<7> Bolivian President Evo Morales pledged solidarity with Cuba and Venezuela http://news.scotsman.com/latest_international.cfm?id=878852006
<8> US: yea, you have to love it.. last time these leftoids jacked on this, they dismissed all of bush's words "We know he didn't mean them.."
<4> Lupine haha yeah
<8> Road: good.. liquidate him.
<8> US: who was it.. when I quoted how Bush *specifically* said Iraq was not an immenent threat.. dismissed it as "we know what bush REALLY MEANT.. and that was iraq=imminent threat to the US" :-)
<7> this South American Oil/Money/Cuba thing just makes me think we really need to pay attention to these guys.
<4> Lupine yeah I forget who that was
<8> Road: absolutely. if we REALLY wanted an invasion of iraq for cheap oil.. we'ld have just taken over venezueala
<7> Lupine: hehehe indeed.
<8> after all, there is a HELL of alot of precedent for sending US troops into latin/south american nations for our own economic prosperity
<8> just look what we did to columbia over what is now today Panama
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