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Comments:
<0> But our best people say a wall isnt neccesary except in populated areas.
<1> I don't see why a wall would be necessary at all if it were easier to come legally
<2> Freeisme, for a start, that would be good
<1> then you'd only have the crooks trying to sneak through
<1> way less people to keep out
<0> There are 100s of miles of deadly deserts where walls would serve little purpose because its so easy with air resources to track them all down and then just send border agents to the places they come in or are sleeping or moving.
<2> Katey, because the demand for getting into the USA is about 100x larger than the political supply
<0> We cant have an open border I conceed that.
<1> Gujiri, 100x larger than political supply?
<1> what does that even mean? And how do you calculate it? :)
<0> I would argue before a jury and present evidence that the intent for most of the history of the southern border was not to eliminate immigrants but to control it.
<2> Katey, I included all the poor people across the world who would love to live in the USA and work for minimum wage
<0> That in fact the politicians wanted a certain number to come through.
<2> there has to be at least 2 billion of those
<1> If you were told, "okay, you can enter the US, but you need to wait one year, or two years, many people would wait.
<0> because of a real need for their labor especially in the western states.
<0> There are more illegals in California than the next 7 or 8 states combined.
<1> but when people know they have to wait as long as 15 years, they don't bother waiting for legal entry
<0> And except on the border I dont know hardly anyone in california who is bothered by them.
<2> Katey, I'm not arguing for the status quo at all
<1> Gujiri, all the poor people in the world aren't accross the Mexico/US border
<0> Conservative or liberal.
<2> katey: what you bring up is a good point, the waiting period
<0> Or leftist
<1> We're talking about that particular border
<1> Gujiri, yes. I've mentioned it a few times. :)
<2> Well In some sense people WILL have to queue up
<1> if it were easier and quicker to enter legally, many many people would choose to do so
<2> katey you can't get away from some incidental waiting period. that's just natural
<1> And the people who would choose not to would be far fewer than what we have today
<0> Police in oregon are ordered to leave them alone.. their economic importance is too significant to their economy.
<1> Which would make security at the border easier to manage
<0> Katey the need to be able to break it down to like 6 months not 6 years.
<1> Freeisme, even one to two years would be a big improvement
<1> People can wait that long
<0> they could make a conditional list quickly based on police records, fingerprints, other examinations, which could create a pool.
<0> very quickly
<1> but 16 years?
<1> sheesh
<0> and when there were needs by workers. (No I said 6 months)
<1> those are your best years if you're already in your 20s
<2> Freeisme, the problem with that is that the mexican military and police are corrupted by drug trafficking.
<0> When workers are needed the people who would decide would be economists who are pro growth and have no bone in the fight.
<1> Also, cracking down hard on businesses that hire illegally would reduce the demand for illegal workers
<0> So they could order 100k, to be allowed into california..
<1> also, reducing the pressure on the border
<0> And it would be done.
<0> Katey yeah because a lot of the ones they catch are the same people not different peopel even though they are counted 2 or 3 times
<2> Bush should tell mexico to get rid of their drug trafficking... He never will... he won't even mention it to mexico... F**k being polite.. Bush needs to tell Fox to clamp down or the wall is coming down on the border
<0> Abusive Domain or User
<0> Bush has told mexico to get rid of their drug trafficking, the problem is its not something possible to do.
<1> Mexico's police force is a joke
<0> Noone is going to keep drugs out of america no matter what they do
<2> It's a weak statement not meant to affect any change..
<2> there has to be consequences
<1> the government does basically nothing to support them
<0> Katey yep
<0> Bush wants drugs interdicted more than I do.
<0> Its not a lack of desire
<0> its a lack of ability
<1> I don't care about the drugs as much as the sort of people who tend to be selling them
<1> thugs
<1> the US has enough home grown crooks
<2> Freeisme, How can you say what bush wants more than you? THe guy is an opaque gelatinous semi-sentient fluid
<1> we don't need to import them. :)
<0> People fly drugs in, they boat them in. they smuggle them in directly, they drop them from airplanes without landing..
<0> There are a million ways to get drugs into the USA
<2> True
<0> As long as there is profit and Demand.. It will happen.
<2> but Drugs are destroying mexico, BECAUSE of our open borders
<0> The demand problem is what Reagan said was the problem, people in america are demanding drugs, lots of drugs and so we punish the people who supply them with thier desires.. Im not sure about the logic in that.
<0> Whose worse a mexican drug dealer or the 1000s of American users who have employed him
<2> Our politicians are willfully negligent in the total corruption of the mexican government
<0> But if we legalized drugs we would end the profits in smuggling overnight.
<0> You could buy legal quality tested, pure drugs from the US drug stores, for less than the dealers.
<0> Then crime could go down
<0> And profits for evil people would stop
<2> Freeisme, It might work as a 10-20 year plan, but in the long run, casual possesion of hard stimulants or pain killers is a wart on society.
<0> You want to get to evil get to the columbia drug kingpins who m*** murder for their business, who told my friends uncle to give them his land in Columbia, He refused, they said leave it or you are dead. he left it.
<0> And he would have been a fool to not give away his land.
<0> he would of died for it.
<2> Freeisme, you know what the vector is for our civilization? Legalization is an outlying possibility..
<3> my god FT
<0> I think first time they offered him a pittance to pay for it
<0> second time they simply said go.
<3> i AGREED with Kubrix!
<3> =0
<3> we had a reasonable conversation even!
<3> =0
<3> i am going soft
<3> hehehe
<2> **** I bet 50% of you don't even know what a vector is
<0> These are the people rememeber who murdered judges left and right (not politically left and right), positionally, To their left side or right side, which ever way the rifles were pointed or the bombs were set
<0> We wouldnt legalize drugs because there is nothing wrong with drugs.
<0> we would legalize to prevent a much worse evil.
<0> What the drug war is doing to columbia and to our own police forces, dea and Afghanistan. Why shouldnt they be able to cultivate opium ?
<4> Freeisme: im waiting for "FreeBase" come on man :)
<0> Its there land.
<3> FT look at your privy damn it
<3> hehhee
<3> ooops thats about Monitor lizards
<3> sorry FT
<3> wrong book
<0> No prob
<3> hahahahha
<0> I think I might install it though
<0> bbiab
<3> god my wife bought 20 feet of velcro
<3> i can't stop playing with it
<3> its like woo hoo!
<1> RustyFord, she can use it to illustrate what a vector is
<1> :)
<3> what else can i make stick!
<1> Gujiri thinks we're too st00pid to figger it out
<3> hahahhaha
<3> hahahahha
<2> Katey, I said 50%
<2> geez
<3> can you say "riiiiiiippppp!!"
<1> oooh. only half of us are dumb
<1> :)
<1> well that's way better. :P
<2> so you're not dumb
<2> big deal
<3> no dumb would be putting only one side on both surfaces
<3> expecting them to stick
<1> :)
<2> katey I was just cynical whether or not people could even understand what I said in that sentence.. random thought.
<3> why won't this stick damn it!!!
<3> Lupine hahahahah wait til you throw in a perl 7 data base
<3> =)
<3> now stfu BOI!
<3> heheheh
<5> i am not doing this by personal choice :P
<3> i didn't say you were
<1> I'm gonna go watch a WC match with the kids....if I can figger out all the complimicated buttons on the remote, that is.
<1> bbl
<1> :P
<5> I should be like a CS instructor RTFM! and not try to learn what they already do
<2> What's WC?
<2> Video game Soccer is fun as hell
<2> I'm not a soccer fan though
<3> personally i think C is better than C++
<3> =)
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