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Comments:
<0> Of course it does Timur. Money pays bills, and less money in your pocket, the less power you have to spend on personal needs
<1> your company matches your contribution
<2> ok then you dont pay twice as much
<1> ss tax is 15%, split between you and your employer
<1> so you only see the 7.6ish%
<0> And it is not up to the government to retire people
<1> cl***ic example of a hidden tax
<3> branh: and yet, there are millions of Americans who pay SS taxes and don't have debt. And millions more who have a controllable debt.
<0> When the baby boomers retire, they are going to take a lot of money out of SS
<1> if no ss tax, youd get the 7.6% you pay, and the money your employer pays
<2> lets get gas chambers going
<3> I'm an example of the former, pretty much everyone I know is in one of those two categories
<2> i see it as a viable solution
<0> Timur, there are millions of Americans in debt. I never said SS was the primary reason behind debt, it is one of many
<0> High property taxes also cause debt
<3> there's no necessary correlation.
<2> its morons and credit cards
<4> fiat money systems backed by fractional reserve banking causes debt.
<3> maybe having to have new tvs and cars and clothes every 6 months is a bigger cause
<2> the guy who works at walmart with the 50K of credit card debt cuz he cant live "to his liking" on the walmart wage could be a problem
<3> maybe irresponsible budgeting and spending generally is a bigger cause. I'd say it wa
<3> s
<0> Well whatever responsiblity a person doesn't take in their personal lives, they expect the government to relieve the burden
<0> Or at least that is mentality I've encountered with people
<3> td: there's always 'getting a better job' or dealing with what you have at the moment responsibly
<2> they should severly limit who gets allowed credit cards
<5> You do know about the fiasco over the Golden Gate Bridge, right?
<3> I disagree, since most people may *try* to get .gov help, but the .gov for the most part tells them, fine, go get a job and deal
<2> because most people just fill em up
<3> td: I agree, but they don't.
<2> lets lobby bush
<0> Timur now that is a good thing
<6> Clyde5, it shouldn't be called that - its not made of gold and there is no gate...
<2> Bush will listen if we tell him
<2> only problem is, he only accepts large bills
<4> your system is so screwed up and all you people do is complain about it on IRC and then endorse the same system again every four years.
<2> by the briefcase
<0> I like how people bitch about coporate wellfare, but are oddly silent when you tell them to vote these people out of office
<5> Every year, some people leap off the Golden Gate Bridge. So the liberals want to build a suicide barrier for the bridge. This will "catch" the jumpers and give them a 2nd chance to reconsider their actions. It will cost upwards of 50 million dollars to conduct a 2 year study to fit the barrier aesthetically and seismically. It will require an increase of toll from $5 to $8. Anyone objecting is accused of being heartless and cruel.
<5> i am not kidding you
<0> I went to a liberal channel with a bunch of liberal bitching about coporate wellfare
<0> And then I tell them "vote them out of office", "get pertitions", "educate the voter base". But they continued to want to bitch
<0> Never once did I hear of any action that should be taken regarding tat
<2> the voter base is pretty hard to educate
<0> Well anything worth an effort is generally hard to do
<2> just look at the DeLay situation, republicans still think he's innocent
<6> CometBaby, does it give word counts of the senators vs. Alito?
<0> But it is equally apathetic to sit back and say that "people are stupid" and then just leave them alone
<4> people are stupid.
<0> Delay is a liberal witch hunt
<7> td-, seems you are pretty hard to educate when you make stupid comments like this -->[07:41] <2> Bush will listen if we tell him [07:41] <2> only problem is, he only accepts large bills
<0> At least that whole situation was a liberal witch hunt
<6> branh0913, and Pelosi is a liberal witch :-)
<3> that's funny, one could apply exactly the same comment here
<3> * on irc in general
<0> Liberals are preoccupied with conservatives, not the other way around
<0> Go to any liberal conference, meeting, orgainization, doesn't matter. They will spend an excessive amount of time bitching about the opposition
<4> branh0913: it's not liberals vs. conservatives, it's the State vs. you.
<3> that'd be funny if it weren't so untrue
<3> scroll up for the past 10 years
<7> This is typical jack*** liberal thinking ---> [07:44] <2> just look at the DeLay situation, republicans still think he's innocent
<7> Let's just forget about being innocent unil PROVEN guilty.
<4> Timur: yes, the State has grown substantially in the past 10 years, i agree.
<8> Delay is guilty....
<9> To the tune of ominous military drums, the offensive Liberal TV ad says, Stephen Harper actually announced he wants to increase military presence in our cities. Canadian cities. Soldiers with guns. In our cities. In Canada. We did not make this up. Choose your Canada.
<9> hahahaha
<9> ^^
<3> Zaw: as well it needs to in some ways, esp in ways relating to security
<8> heh..he let his blood money spigots poke above the surface....\\
<10> mmmmmm turkey bacon
<4> Timur: you get what you deserve. it's a shame that most people think like you, and rely upon government so much.
<8> also..political paybacks are a bitch
<3> but in any case, the idea that people here don't 'consistently bitch' is a total ischaracterization
<3> Zaw: I deserve security, I'm getting security, voila
<4> rofl
<9> roffles
<3> waffles!
<8> they who sacrifice freedom for security.....
<9> Zaw is like a cryptoanarchist
<9> or a non-cryptoanarchist
<3> .. have to listen to people use facile quotations that have no bearing
<8> mmm Canadian Bacon!!!
<0> hmmm, don't you sacrifice freedom for security in a wellfare state?
<8> ask Canada and Europe
<0> Thanks that answers my question CryHavoc
<8> oatmeal is ready...later peeps :)
<4> branh0913: those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither (Ben Franklin)
<11> did you guys remember to take yer fibercon and geritol this morning?
<9> FEMA, i did
<4> as i said, the shame is that most people want 'security' and do not want liberty.
<9> liberty is fine, within reasonable limits of course
<11> ok, Poof! Bada-Bing! There, you are now more secure.
<9> the debate seems to be what 'reasonable' is
<3> yes, it's a shame people want security
<3> Lup, why do you own guns again?
<9> its ****ing foggy out
<11> Josey Wales
<3> because the world is such a calm, peaceful, reasonable place
<9> i can't see like 3 feet outside my window
<12> nice out eh herzen
<9> Yeah
<13> Timur I own a gun .. I am licensed to carry, in fact. I think a gun is a great equalizer for a woman who is no match for a man, otherwise.
<9> Thrasher`, Candidates Debate at BU on Thursday at 6pm
<9> in the Ceremonial Room (Pow-Wow) room
<13> at BULL ?
<9> in the Health Sciences center
<3> Comet: and ostensibly, you own that gun because you want security, right? therefore the desire for security is important to you - as it is to most people
<9> All 7 candidates for Brandon-Souris will be there
<9> even the Communist =D
<12> hmm...Im going to end up not votin anyways, meh...dont like any candidate really
<9> Vote Merv Tweed
<0> Well the point is that you can only depend on yourself for security
<13> Timur I own a gun, because times occur when I need to defend myself. I have no desire to kill anyone.
<9> The tory bandwagon is leaving, so you better jump on it on the 23rd
<9> Thrasher`, Are you still registered in Onanole?
<9> that would make your MP Inky Mark?
<12> yep
<0> At the end of the day you can only depend on yourself for anything. When you put your security in someone elses hands, they aren't going to take it as seriously as you do
<11> CometBaby, its sad that a smile and good eye contact doesn't work on everyone.
<0> So why would you put security in the hand of the government?
<4> CometBaby: you should also spy on all of your neighbors and listen to what they're saying so that you are most secure, and go start shooting up the 'hood' down the street just in case they were thinking of harming you, of course. don't forget to put cameras everywhere, too.
<1> if katrina didnt convince you that you NEED a gun
<1> nothing will
<9> Zaw, shouldn't play with fire
<4> Herzen: i'm simply pointing out the absurdity of 'security' that Timur is trying to justify.
<14> okay i am all for guns but i dont think shooting a huricane will help
<9> t0tn4gvn, shooting looters will help
<0> I think he was talking about the looters
<3> except it's not absurd that people who have an obvious link to, say, terrorism should be spied on
<13> Zaw .. I don't even know my neighbor's names. But if they are telephoning terrorists in foreign countries, I hope to hell *uncle* is spying on them. I am not paranoid and your post is stupidly ridiculous.
<3> in fact, it'd be absurd not to.
<9> Timur, I agree, but it should be put to judicial review
<9> IMO
<3> perhaps in most cases but not necessarily all
<4> Timur: there's an obvious link to, say, gang violence in the inner cities. shouldn't we be killing them and spying upon them or 'containing' them also? they're a more direct threat than 'terrorists'.
<1> CometBaby the three questions that destroy almost all liberal ideas are 'compared to what' 'at what price' and 'based on what evidence'
<9> Timur, Getting a warrant is a pretty easy thing
<13> Zaw .. I believe we should spy on terrorists both foreign and domestic.
<4> like i said, those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither. you get what you want.
<3> Zaw: we spy on them, we arrest them, and if they shoot at arresting officers, we may kill them.
<1> 'at what price' is the one that destroys the idea that we shouldnt spy on terrorists in order to protect our civil liberties
<3> yeah, that tired cliche has definitely gotten more than its share of play here
<4> CometBaby: yes, and soon we can re-cl***ify 'terrorists' to include people that don't agree with the State. good plan.
<3> Herz: it can be easy, it can also pose an unjustifiable delay, and/or pose the risk of leaks
<9> How do you define Liberty zaw?
<1> like they say, our constitution is not a suicide pact
<13> Zaw .. that's another exageration. Is that all you are capable of? Can't you make reasonable debate without taking everything into lala land of ridiculousness?
<1> i gotta get some sleep shigt
<1> ****
<9> Comet, the boy is an Anarchist, you've got to expect some 'lala land of ridiculousness'ness
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