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Comments:
<0> and it never gets beyond that state
<0> like the dandelion it withers away not the state
<1> never?
<2> But you'll notice that communist organizations practice enforecement of the ideology within their own organizations.
<1> nevers a long time
<0> communism withers away
<0> because thats as far as communism can ever get
<1> explain cuba
<2> Gnar: that's like saying we haven't seen the Tooth Fairy to know if he's real or not.
<1> 80 miles off our shore and it sure as **** hasnt "witherd away"
<1> its not true communist either though
<0> Cuba is a totalitarian dictatorship where the people have nearly starved to death when Russia withdrew aid.
<1> another socialist STATE
<1> you're still dodging my point
<1> cause you dont like it
<2> Gnar: here's a clue: if we haven't seen "true" communism despite a century of its advocates allegedly trying to bring it about, then maybe, just maybe, it's a Tooth Fairy theory.
<1> communism in theory strives for no state
<0> There best method of survival is trading with western capitalists in fact thats what keeps them from death
<1> how many times do i have to ****ing repeat myself
<0> prostitutes are a huge industry in cuba
<1> discotaco: russia was a socialist republic
<0> its the only way to make money unless you are one of the privelages few
<1> they strove towards communism and failed
<2> Gnar: thanks for the tip. But that still doesn't address my point.
<0> Gnar, yes of course a democratic republic of a socialist nature as a result of commnist theory
<1> your point about the dandelions?
<1> freetrade: yeah ia gree
<1> so wtf are you arguing about?
<1> my point is past that socialist state lies communism where there is no state and no property
<1> they've never attained that
<0> Gnar, why is it that Marx said that money would not exist in a communist state but that they would use labor vouchers as means of payment ? How is labor vouchers not in fact currency just as cash is ?
<0> Labour vouchers became money
<1> dance around my point again
<1> quit babbling on
<2> Gnar: every nation that strove toward communism as you define it has FAILED. How many more nations have to fail and how many more billions of people have to suffer oppression, starvation and death before you and your holdouts are willing to concede that Communist "theory" is bollocks on stilts?
<1> and taclke this point
<1> if you're so smart
<0> The point is Gnar, Communism is a failed ideology which was flawed from its inception and was nothing less than an old losers dream of utopian society...
<1> discotaco: i never said communist theory isn't horse****. i said the theory is to strive towards no state or property
<0> There is no past the socialist state
<1> are you two that ****ing dense
<0> Never has communism p***ed the socialist state
<1> i agree
<1> i said that 20 minutes ago
<0> Marx didnt say it could happen, he said it was inevitable
<1> so wtf are you arguing about?
<2> Gnar: 1 more? 10 more? 100 more? How many more people have to starve in prisons or lack of food before you concede that Communist "theory" ****s? 20 million? 200 million? tell me. How many more people are you willing to send to the gulags or starvation or death?
<0> that it would happen
<0> that it was clear as could be
<1> freetrade: the world hasnt ended yet
<1> maybe it is
<1> How many more people are you willing to send to the gulags or starvation or death? <====so now im a communist? haha
<1> you guys are ridiculous
<0> That it was historical fate and yet it never did happen it never got beyond socialism in fact communism never even got to the type of socialism Marx predicted.
<0> It always ended up ran by Party leaders like tyrants
<3> did i just join in the middle of a hot debate
<0> why ?
<2> Gnar: you imply Communist theory is workable every time you claim it has never been acheived and therefore "we don't know." Your word games are tiresome.
<1> WHETHER OR NOT THE ****ING THEORY IS SOUND. THE THEORY IS TO STRIVE TOWARDS NO STATE. NOW KINDLY STFU
<3> or is just FreeTrade babbling like usual and dodging things?
<1> discotaco: i never implied it was workable
<0> Because the nature of man withour the rule of law and government is evil.
<1> i only implied what the theory is.
<1> but i guess communist theory is to create failed governments...
<1> pfft
<1> freetrade you're a lightweight man
<2> THE THEORY IS NOT ****ING SOUND, HISTORY HAS BORNE THAT FACT OUT WITH HORRIFIC RESULTS ALREADY. NOW KINDLY STFU
<0> The first premise of humanity is given time man will resort to evil and given opportunity, it takes an act of will an act of logic and proceses for a man to become moral
<2> Gnar: you imply Communist theory is workable every time you claim it has never been acheived and therefore "we don't know." Your word games are tiresome.
<3> did Freetrade talk about the dandelion being sewn into a rose or some **** yet?
<0> Morality is what keeps us from killing each other.
<1> discotaco: where did i say it was workable?
<2> Gnar: you imply Communist theory is workable every time you claim it has never been acheived and therefore "we don't know." Your word games are tiresome.
<3> thats the sign of a lost argument
<2> Should I repeat myself again?
<1> discotaco: i dont know whether it is or isnt
<2> I can do it all night if you like.
<2> Gnar: you imply Communist theory is workable every time you claim it has never been acheived and therefore "we don't know." Your word games are tiresome.
<0> I talked about something that is a parable, That communism can only become what historically it has always became.
<0> I can not become what people like Gnar desire it to become
<1> yeah you both can babble on all night, im still right in saying that communist theory strives towards zero state
<1> im not a ****ing communist you moron
<0> because mans fundamental nature and instinct would have to be good.
<2> Gnar: then you're deliberately ignorant, which is one type of imbecile I have no patience for. **** off and have a nice life.
<1> go read what the theory states
<3> Discotaco fails it
<1> and then eat your words
<1> or do i have to paste **** like freetrade
<0> You would have to continuously branwash children from age 2-25 to get peopel to cooperate for the social good and even then individuals would revolt.
<1> you guys minds shut off when it comes to communism or somethign
<1> im not advocating it
<3> I need to up the dosage on my medication, anyone else?
<1> im just saying the reasons why others advocate it
<1> what their motivation is
<0> Adam smith was much smarter, man in his pursuit of self interest benefits the whole a lot more than Ideological fanatics who try to Impose by police power utopia on us.
<1> but you want to cry about it
<0> and if we resist we are killed.
<4> yeah man, toss me another xanax
<1> Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
<1> SOCIALIST republics
<0> Gnar, The reasons anyone advocates Communism is ignorance pure and simple.
<4> werd
<5> Jesus, this room's a one-note samba.
<0> Thats the only reason.
<1> freetrade: yeah and?
<0> Because Reason argues 100% against communism
<4> Samizdat, no way man, this is quality entertainment
<5> Heh
<1> freetrade: you havent been using reason. only emotion
<5> Make it Kettle Korn, Doo!
<3> I'll tell you, gnar provides an excellent argument, and I'll I've seen out of FreeTrade is rubbish
<1> communism defined: Communism is a political ideology that seeks to establish a future cl***less, stateless social organization based upon common ownership of the means of production.
<0> When the experience of communism in every instance of its seed as someone reminded me of, is tyranny why would we expect it to be different ?
<4> w3rd
<4> kettle korn ftw
<0> Are you saying that Communism hasnt been tried enough ?
<0> 50% of the world almost was Communist at one point.
<1> no im saying this is what communism is:
<1> Communism is a political ideology that seeks to establish a future cl***less, stateless social organization based upon common ownership of the means of production.
<3> FACT: FreeTrade is Rubbish
<1> nothing more nothing less
<1> im not advocating any idealogy
<0> Communism had every chance of proving itself and it only proved to be a tyranny which usually included m*** murder every single time.
<1> im just telling you what communism is
<0> Then why do you defend communism ?
<1> where did i defend it?
<0> You havent even appeared to have studied it.
<1> dude
<0> Early on
<1> Communism is a political ideology that seeks to establish a future cl***less, stateless social organization based upon common ownership of the means of production.
<1> you disagree with that definition?
<0> You said it was eventually the state withering away (Well I said that because thats exactly what marx said) but you said the same thing in non quites.
<1> do you disagree with it yes or no?
<0> non quotes
<0> And I say to you that communism is not like that,
<1> YES OR NO?
<1> answer the ****ing question
<0> I agree that communism is not about the state withering away despite any claims it makes to the contrary
<1> answer the ****ing question
<3> is the caller there?
<0> I believe it is about consolidating power into the hands of the few to wield totalitarian control over the many
<1> starsky: i think the lights on but nobody's home
<1> freetrade: then you're wrong about what communist IDEALOGY is
<1> you're right about what has happened when professed communists took power
<1> but we're talking about idealogy
<1> starsky: is freetrade a bot?
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