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Comments:
<0> Have you looked at the American public lately FDSA?
<1> I try not to, for the most part.
<2> hey
<1> But if I'm paying money to recieve something from someone, and they're plainly ignorant of what they're requiring me to do
<3> you two have fun , i'm gonna take a break
<1> Then I'm going to raise a fit.
<1> But let's look at it for a moment.
<1> Linux is a better OS because Slackware makes my grandmother unable to do anything.
<1> :D
<3> i doubt the have better luck in windows anyway .. but thats just my personal opinion
<3> she*
<1> She does.
<1> She can check her email.
<1> That's about it, that's about all she needs.
<3> then she should use a live cd instead of slackware
<2> windoz just eats cpu with anti- virus scanning
<1> Or she should NOT use linux.
<1> Windows is easy to deal with.
<1> If she goes to the store to buy some bingo program
<1> It'll work.
<1> Won't with *nix.
<3> maybe she should stick to windows afterall
<4> no, it won't. windows will crash when she tries installing it. or some dlls won't match. or she'll have picked up so much spyware it won't run. etc.
<1> furrywolf: That's invalid statements.
<1> You need to try to be less biased.
<1> Or shut up.
<1> One of the two.
<3> why do you have to be so mean anyway .. sheesh
<3> :P
<1> I'm not being mean.
<4> I'm not likely to do either of those two, so try actually responding to the argument? :P
<1> You have no arguement.
<4> would you like me to find some statistics of the percentage of crapware-loaded windows machines? how about some studies on the problems it causes?
<4> or how about some stories of windows crashing when installing a program?
<1> How often do you see people in here who can't understand simple concepts of linux?
<1> Or watch people break things while trying to compile something?
<1> Or watch people have no clue how to patch a kernel?
<1> I can go on with the amazing amount of ignorance that is portrayed by users who come here for help.
<4> how often do I see people in other channels who can't understand windows? quite a few... and it's especially hard given the lack of documentation for windows.
<1> Windows has no monopoly on breaking.
<3> i have to agree with furrywolf
<1> So don't try to imply it does.
<3> ignorant people will always be ignorant . no matter on which os they are on
<1> Also
<4> nor does it have a monopoly on working. so don't try to imply it does.
<1> Don't try to imply that Linux doesn't have security flaws.
<1> Because it does.
<1> Sure, updates might come out faster, but there are people who care so much about their precious uptime, that they'll never apply them.
<4> fewer, usually less severe, and more quickly patched. :)
<1> Or just don't know how.
<1> Less severe?
<1> When any number of given apps can be hit to rm -rf / a box?
<1> That's less severe than a popup?
<1> Seriously?
<4> yes. when my web browser allows arbritary code execution, it doesn't allow someone to install software as root/administrator.
<1> But if you look at how the vulnerabilities are actually used
<1> They're used for commercial gain on windows
<1> and for raw destruction on *nix
<1> Which is worse? Having popups (Which none of my windows boxes have ever had, btw) or waking up to find you need to reimage a box entirely?
<4> nah. destruction is counterproductive. this is why rootkits, etc exist.
<4> someone doesn't root your linux box them rm -rf /. they root your linux box, then install a rootkit that lets them run any programs they want while completely hiding their existance from the user.
<1> You must not have talked to many people who've had their boxes cracked.
<3> whats the point of rooting a box and rm -rf / ?
<3> it*
<1> Being a ****.
<4> and implying popups are the worst crapware can do is a bit misleading. the same crapware might also be logging your online banking information, making your box unstable, etc.
<1> Which is what people who crack **** love.
<3> must be a windows user then
<2> if you use a firewall and common sense linux is hard to crack
<4> or, rather, I've talked to too many people who've had their boxes cracked. number of rm -rf /'s: 0. number of rootkits, packet sniffers, spam forwarders, etc: lots.
<3> not to mention IDS / IDP
<1> If you use a firewall and common sense, Windows has no problems.
<1> You all have this idea that Linux is vastly superior to Windows
<1> And it ain't.
<1> If it were, it'd own the market.
<3> not really . you can still exploit them in various ways .. like the usb thumbdrive trick ..
<1> Sure, it's great, but it's not great for end users.
<2> linux is vastly faster than windows
<4> FDSA: and don't confuse currently available software with the OS itself.
<1> I'm not confusing anything.
<4> also, if you want even more security, look into selinux or the like.
<3> and the popups was handled by the browser .. not the OS istelf .. am i right ?
<3> is*
<1> I don't use IE
<1> I haven't used IE since Netscape.
<4> Routermen: he's talking about adware... programs installed that open random windows with random advertisements.
<3> ic
<1> So talking about the browser and adware is stupid.
<4> adware being the least destructive form of crapware.
<2> popup is a call to the browser
<1> There's no huge super wonderful advantage to Linux.
<3> yes there is .. price
<4> FDSA: so you don't consider freedom an advantage, then?
<1> What freedom don't I have right now?
<3> FDSA: the source code ?
<1> I don't program.
<1> So I don't require kernel source.
<3> ok , stick with windows :)
<1> I use both
<3> youre better off that way
<1> Are you ignorant?
<1> I use both.
<1> They're tools.
<1> Neither is superior.
<4> that's like saying freedom of speach is irrelevant because at the moment you have nothing to say.
<5> I play games on Windows. I use Linux for everything else
<4> s/speach/speech
<6> Isn't it?
<3> why do you use linux if you dont really "use" it ?
<1> How am I not really "using" it?
<1> Because I don't program?
<1> Excuse me?
<1> Since when is linux only for coders?
<3> i'm not talking about coding
<4> because obviously you must not use it if you don't realize how vastly superior it is, of course. :)
<4> bbl, my food should be getting done
<3> i'm talking about the ability to do what windows can do .. and even more
<6> I don't think gnu and linux is ready for standalone end users yet.
<6> Its especially not ready for people that don't understanding licensing.
<1> jblack hit the nail on the head.
<6> most of
<3> FDSA is dragging this conversation into a competition
<5> I have had a success story helping a local writer with a disability switch to Ubuntu
<1> Where is competition?
<3> i'm leaving this topic
<1> Seriously?
<3> have a nice day
<6> many of the people here don't program at all. I don't think they should be using linux yet.
<1> Good, leave.
<5> He would not have made it alone
<5> I had to help him during the first few weeks
<1> All I said is that neither are better.
<1> If that's a competition, I don't what to say.
<6> Oh.. One is definitely better.
<1> Linux has it's good points
<1> Windows has it's good points.
<4> I switched an elderly female relative to linux a couple years back. she couldn't write a line of code if her life depended on it. she says it's so much better she has no clue how anyone ever uses windows.
<6> Its not a question of better. Its a question of maturity.
<5> He has read documentation and finds his way nowadays. Last time, he needed an personal finance application, he found his way :)
<4> she now tries to convince everyone she knows to switch to linux.
<6> The free software world isn't mature enough for end users. They make all sorts of silly mistakes, like running proprietary drivers. Its not because they're stupid.. its because they lack the knowledge and experience to think long term, and free software isn't good enough yet to make the right answers obvious.
<1> There's also ease of use issues.
<6> Its not ease of use. Its lack of training.
<1> A lot of distros have tried making themselves as easy to use as Windows, but for the most part, I think they've just boogered things up
<6> The windows world isn't any easier.
<4> FDSA: my relative I just talked about finds it much easier to use. things simply work, rather than wasting her time figuring out why things don't work, as happened on windows.
<5> I disagree with the ease of use
<5> My wife id not computer savvy. To her both are equally hard.
<1> A lot of people who buy Dell at Circuit City might disagree.
<5> Actually, she was pissed at me when I mostly remained on Windows when I played games during my end of year vacation
<6> People buying dells at circuit city don't have a choice at all.
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